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welcome to tales from the rabbit hole

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I'm your host Mick West my guest today

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is Mike Mike is a member of the 9/11

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truth community from New York and we're

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going to talk about his involvement in

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that community and so welcome to tell

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from the rabbit hole Mike thanks Mick

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thanks for having me on the show

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you did it okay now is there something

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you want you wanted to do before we got

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started sure yeah I just wanted to have

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a very quick moment of silence for the

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victims of 9/11 because I think it's

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really important to keep that in mind as

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we have these discussions and that

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includes all the people killed that day

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and includes you do more people that

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have died from breathing in the dust at

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Ground Zero and includes all the people

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killed in the 911 wars both Americans

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all right thank you me alright well

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thank you for that and thank you for

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being here now

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you emailed me a few days ago and yeah

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you've basically told me that you just

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kind of seen some of my stuff on the

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internet and you you kind of found some

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of it interesting and obviously you

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disagree with some of it but then again

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you probably agree with some bits here

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and there

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can you say like how you got into the

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9/11 truth movement sure I believe the

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official story for about 10 years and a

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friend of mine nagged and nagged and

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nagged and nagged me for three years to

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watch the film zeitgeist the movie and I

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was actually more interested in Italy in

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part about Jesus not existing then I was

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in 9/11 piece and I'm an atheist and

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that was the topic that I was already

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interested in I actually read a book

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called Jesus mysteries which is very

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very similar to what was expressed in

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the film I still know what's really the

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most historically accurate thing about

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that but it was interesting to me anyway

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and the 9/11 piece of that film it

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didn't convince me of anything right

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away but it just kind of got me thinking

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wow this is pretty interesting I never

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never heard of most of the things they

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talk about in that film I just started

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doing research so who did you did you

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immediately start like reading or

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looking at other things after that or

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was it just kind of just zeitgeist for a

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while and you were focused on that or

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did you it was he like an immediate

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springboard to do other things

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I was immediate but it was pretty quick

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to say within a few months I was already

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trying to find the reports and read up

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on some of that stuff whose change was

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another big one and it's funny because

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you know you've talked with some other

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people in the movement before who whose

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views have evolved and changed over time

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and I'm no different and you know at

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first honestly I have to admit at first

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I was kind of getting sucked into some

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of this nonsense that's in loose change

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and after doing some research and

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listening to most other people are like

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you know these change films they have a

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lot of mistakes and especially the early

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ones you got to really be careful I say

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this all the time to people when you're

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in the 9/11 truth movement you're

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surrounded by BS from all sides as you

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the official VF and so-called man living

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truth be s so how do you how do you go

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about deciding what's the or it's BS and

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what isn't be asked then if you got BS

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on all sides you can't say because it's

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on one side or the other it's BS you

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have to look at the thing itself and and

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dasai so what what do you actually do

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when you're trying to decide whether

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something is BS or not part of the

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answer to that is I'm not always

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completely sure but what I try to do is

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I try to listen to experts on both sides

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and then use my own intelligence to see

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which one of those things seems more

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plausible based on either common sense

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or what I know about science which isn't

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a tremendous amount and I try to keep my

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mind open they're always accepting new

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information because I might you know

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that I'm sure you know that the human

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mind is notoriously terrible at physics

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things seem intuitive to you and they

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make sense but if you do the

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calculations you're completely wrong so

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I try to to always keep an open mind and

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not try not to use intuition too much

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because it's intuitive thinking is not

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scientific thinking yeah you know that

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the mind can play tricks on you and that

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physics is not something that you can

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Intuit all the time and yet you also say

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you use common sense and this is

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something I hear a lot of people say

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they say it's just common sense that the

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towers couldn't have collapsed in that

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way do you think there's like a bit of a

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like a conflict there and what you're

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saying in the like common sense in a way

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is intuition yes it could be mixed yeah

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I didn't realize that but that is kind

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of a contradiction yeah you're you're

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like a member of the 9/11 truth

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community and I guess you have been for

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quite a while you said you like you

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started doing this like about 10 years

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ago what was like the first experience

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you had with kind of like organized in

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the community in the 9/11 community

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probably the event justice and focus in

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New York City in 2016 which is the event

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that produces the 9/11 truth action

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project and the lawyers Committee for

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9/11 inquiry and I had already been

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researching this stuff for a while by

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then but I think that was my first

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you formal you know Gathering was that

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the architects and engineers organized

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that one yeah would be committee also

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mmm-hmm and they they basically got a

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bunch of people up on stage and people

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gave like various presentations officer

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it was almost like kind of like a mock

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trial in a way it wasn't this as I

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remember mhm yeah like they were calling

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all these witnesses for the for the

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prosecution a bit one-sided he could say

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if it was an actual trial in that they

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were just they were calling people up

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who all believe that 9/11 was an inside

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job yeah yeah that was my first

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organized event I also wanted to mention

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you know I mentioned to you before that

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I worked for a crisis hotline and

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actually 9/11 is part of what made our

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place of work what it is today because

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the hotline started in 1995 and it was

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six counselors at one table with six

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phones and every call that came in all

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six phones would ring and people would

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just have an honor system as who would

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take the next call and the resource

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directory that they referred people to

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services was a paper listing of clinics

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alphabetically fast-forward to 9/11

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obviously there's a great need in the

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city for mental health and substance use

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help following the attacks and we got a

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huge grant and expanded greatly today we

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have over a hundred counselors there's a

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very elaborate sophisticated queue

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system that distributes the calls I

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manage the directory it's no longer

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paper directory it's a you know online

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directory th and so that that news

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fluently as well were you working there

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the whole time no I started there in

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2010 which is you know around the same

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time that you got interested in 9/11

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truth is that kind of a yeah a

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coincidence or was that just type of

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thing that was have like change

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happening in your life at the time

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no just coincidence yeah because my

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friend had been bugging me to watch that

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film already for like three years say

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your friend out of interest like is he

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still your friend is he still have the

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same belief yeah is he a member of the

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community no he doesn't really get

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active in it

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he says his own views on the fire but

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he's not really he's not an organizer he

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doesn't join groups or anything like

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that have his opinions about 9/11

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changed over the years I don't think so

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actually

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I think mine have more than who

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interesting interesting yeah

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and actually what's interesting too is

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I'm not sure how familiar you are with

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the zeitgeist film series but there are

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two other films that came after that

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that have nothing to do with 9/11 that

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have to do with the zeitgeist movement

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and I actually got pretty heavily

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involved in that for a while and I still

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believe in the ideology but I kind of

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gave up on trying to convince people of

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it so what is the zeitgeist ideology

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it's like this ideology is a political

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it is the view that instead of making

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decisions about society based on

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politics which is someone's opinion it

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should be based on science and research

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and facts the current paradigm is kind

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of well uses money the zeitgeist

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ideology it proposes the end of money

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which is a lofty goal I know hmm but

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it's achieved through technology through

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the using technology produce goods to

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relieve people of labor basically it's

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been summarized as the application of

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the scientific method for social concern

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that's sort of the gist of it

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so who would get to decide it so what do

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you mean like you say you would use

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science to decide like you know where

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things go and who gets worse and things

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like that but how would that actually

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work in practice though would there be

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somebody like a bunch of scientists like

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making decisions it's supposed to be a

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horizontal movement in which you don't

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really have a hierarchy and I don't know

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the extent that that's really possible

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but I found that there are a lot of

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questions like that about the movement

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and problems and things that need to be

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worked out but it's more the overall

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approach and overall philosophy and view

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that I subscribe to the philosophy of

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providing for human needs over over

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money it's very appealing to me yeah and

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it sounds great so I thinking it's one

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of those things this yeah people will

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say well communism sounded great too

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because communism is about you have to

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each according to his needs and stuff

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like

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but in practice it didn't work out very

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well in in the various implementations

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but I think yeah the big problem with

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all these political systems is how do

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they work in practice they're good with

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the theory and the practice rent in days

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yeah getting right to 911 they're like

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you're a member of the the 9/11 truth

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action projects is that correct yes okay

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what would you do you have do you do

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something there in particular yeah I'm a

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coordinator of the New York City chapter

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actually and there's that like I have

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organizing meetings and things like that

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yeah how many people do you have at

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those meetings

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oh it's been dismal recently two three

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four but the last meeting we had last

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meeting we had about 15 because we what

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happened was we we did an event in All

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Souls Church in New York City which

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featured a bunch of speakers from

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lawyers Committee for a night of an

274
00:10:51,150 --> 00:10:48,190
inquiry there was also that asgaard

275
00:10:53,189 --> 00:10:51,160
Snyder he he was invited to present his

276
00:10:55,980 --> 00:10:53,199
paper a very prestigious engineering

277
00:10:58,740 --> 00:10:55,990
conference in New York but the US

278
00:11:01,680 --> 00:10:58,750
government actually denied his visa Wow

279
00:11:03,509 --> 00:11:01,690
so he Skyped into our event gave a

280
00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:03,519
little talk we had some first responders

281
00:11:08,430 --> 00:11:06,850
as well we had Christopher Joya the I'm

282
00:11:10,350 --> 00:11:08,440
sure you heard of Chris joy of the fire

283
00:11:12,389 --> 00:11:10,360
commissioner yeah sure like a local fire

284
00:11:15,870 --> 00:11:12,399
commissioner at one of the New York five

285
00:11:17,610 --> 00:11:15,880
counties yeah one Island okay so we had

286
00:11:19,860 --> 00:11:17,620
so what happens we had this event there

287
00:11:22,139 --> 00:11:19,870
and it was very well attended we had

288
00:11:23,069 --> 00:11:22,149
approximately 300 people there was kind

289
00:11:25,949 --> 00:11:23,079
of standing room only

290
00:11:28,920 --> 00:11:25,959
okay and I hope to organize that event

291
00:11:31,560 --> 00:11:28,930
actually and we had over a hundred

292
00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:31,570
people sign up to want to be part of the

293
00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:35,170
truth action project so we contacted a

294
00:11:38,189 --> 00:11:36,730
bunch of those people and our last

295
00:11:39,329 --> 00:11:38,199
meeting some of them showed up one guy

296
00:11:42,300 --> 00:11:39,339
came from Rhode Island

297
00:11:43,980 --> 00:11:42,310
mmm just to come to the meeting it was

298
00:11:46,379 --> 00:11:43,990
probably the best meeting we've had in a

299
00:11:48,900 --> 00:11:46,389
long time you know they're only 10 to 15

300
00:11:52,290 --> 00:11:48,910
people that's it's a big turnout for us

301
00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:52,300
actually right yeah kind of surprised it

302
00:12:00,630 --> 00:11:54,970
was so small okay especially in in New

303
00:12:02,189 --> 00:12:00,640
York well you know in New York it's a as

304
00:12:03,449 --> 00:12:02,199
you could imagine it's an extremely

305
00:12:05,009 --> 00:12:03,459
touchy subject

306
00:12:07,499 --> 00:12:05,019
and people have very very strong

307
00:12:09,989 --> 00:12:07,509
feelings about it on both sides

308
00:12:12,059 --> 00:12:09,999
I find it hard I find it hard to talk to

309
00:12:13,799 --> 00:12:12,069
people about 9/11 in New York because of

310
00:12:15,569 --> 00:12:13,809
that emotional connection I'm a little

311
00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:15,579
bit more removed from it because I've

312
00:12:19,290 --> 00:12:17,410
although I'm from New York born and

313
00:12:20,999 --> 00:12:19,300
raised actually wasn't living here at

314
00:12:24,569 --> 00:12:21,009
the time of 9/11 and I didn't lose

315
00:12:27,179 --> 00:12:24,579
anybody in 9/11 that was close to me the

316
00:12:29,999 --> 00:12:27,189
only person I lost was a casual

317
00:12:32,579 --> 00:12:30,009
acquaintance who's on one of the planes

318
00:12:34,169 --> 00:12:32,589
actually yeah yeah yeah I didn't do

319
00:12:37,470 --> 00:12:34,179
anybody I was I was in LA at the time

320
00:12:40,559 --> 00:12:37,480
and I remember there was people from the

321
00:12:42,119 --> 00:12:40,569
office at work who were supposed to be

322
00:12:44,220 --> 00:12:42,129
in the World Trade Center that day but

323
00:12:45,809 --> 00:12:44,230
they it was like that meeting was later

324
00:12:47,669 --> 00:12:45,819
in the day so they didn't show up so

325
00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:47,679
that was going to the closest that I

326
00:12:52,739 --> 00:12:49,689
came to any kind of personal connection

327
00:12:54,239 --> 00:12:52,749
it's like just knowing people who kind

328
00:12:58,499 --> 00:12:54,249
of had a near miss and then just talking

329
00:12:59,850 --> 00:12:58,509
to people who were there I yeah when

330
00:13:01,439 --> 00:12:59,860
they came back you know I said they were

331
00:13:03,449 --> 00:13:01,449
stuck in New York for a few days because

332
00:13:05,579 --> 00:13:03,459
of the air traffic shut down and then

333
00:13:07,230 --> 00:13:05,589
they came back few minutes later and

334
00:13:09,449 --> 00:13:07,240
tell people about yeah what had

335
00:13:10,769 --> 00:13:09,459
transpired how they got stuck and you

336
00:13:13,109 --> 00:13:10,779
know how they were gonna be there and

337
00:13:14,069 --> 00:13:13,119
their little personal stories of the

338
00:13:16,679 --> 00:13:14,079
chaos and everything

339
00:13:18,119 --> 00:13:16,689
yeah he's interesting like yeah the size

340
00:13:20,220 --> 00:13:18,129
of the community I wouldn't like try to

341
00:13:21,239 --> 00:13:20,230
be a I don't want to come across as

342
00:13:23,460 --> 00:13:21,249
something like trying to like the

343
00:13:26,489 --> 00:13:23,470
littlest but it is interesting that

344
00:13:29,910 --> 00:13:26,499
there isn't that much public involvement

345
00:13:32,009 --> 00:13:29,920
when you look at like the the surveys of

346
00:13:34,530 --> 00:13:32,019
people if you if you do surveys of

347
00:13:36,059 --> 00:13:34,540
American people and ask like you know do

348
00:13:37,410 --> 00:13:36,069
you think there should be another 9/11

349
00:13:39,809 --> 00:13:37,420
investigation there are some things like

350
00:13:41,340 --> 00:13:39,819
that you usually get quite a chunk of

351
00:13:42,569 --> 00:13:41,350
people on you do you think the American

352
00:13:45,329 --> 00:13:42,579
government is telling us everything

353
00:13:47,129 --> 00:13:45,339
about 9/11 yeah you'll get you'll get

354
00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:47,139
like a very large percentage of people

355
00:13:50,850 --> 00:13:48,970
no not a majority but still quite a

356
00:13:53,369 --> 00:13:50,860
quite a lot but then you you get these

357
00:13:56,489 --> 00:13:53,379
meetings where you only get handfuls of

358
00:13:58,499 --> 00:13:56,499
people showing up and it seems like you

359
00:14:01,289 --> 00:13:58,509
know people have these ideas but it

360
00:14:02,759 --> 00:14:01,299
doesn't translate into action yeah kind

361
00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:02,769
of like my friend who got me to watch

362
00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:03,970
the zeitgeist he's never done anything

363
00:14:07,769 --> 00:14:06,490
Korean movement to my knowledge he just

364
00:14:09,210 --> 00:14:07,779
that's kind of what you and I were

365
00:14:11,090 --> 00:14:09,220
talking about the other day where the

366
00:14:13,409 --> 00:14:11,100
difference between a cause and a hobby

367
00:14:16,019 --> 00:14:13,419
you know some people treat 9/11 as a

368
00:14:17,090 --> 00:14:16,029
hobby kind of like people who read civil

369
00:14:19,950 --> 00:14:17,100
war books

370
00:14:21,720 --> 00:14:19,960
go to Civil War reenactments and stuff

371
00:14:24,570 --> 00:14:21,730
it's a hobby for them they think it's

372
00:14:26,250 --> 00:14:24,580
really cool for some reason and people

373
00:14:28,290 --> 00:14:26,260
are like that with 9/11 I don't I don't

374
00:14:31,380 --> 00:14:28,300
approach it that way to me it's too

375
00:14:33,780 --> 00:14:31,390
important to just say like oh you know

376
00:14:35,730 --> 00:14:33,790
my hobby is reading about 9/11 I've been

377
00:14:37,410 --> 00:14:35,740
translated into some kind of action yeah

378
00:14:39,150 --> 00:14:37,420
I could tell this very important to you

379
00:14:42,290 --> 00:14:39,160
like having the moments of silence there

380
00:14:44,910 --> 00:14:42,300
and I would imagine like because you get

381
00:14:48,150 --> 00:14:44,920
in this the crisis hotline though and

382
00:14:49,500 --> 00:14:48,160
would you touch people who you know 9/11

383
00:14:51,330 --> 00:14:49,510
is a big part of life you know why

384
00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:51,340
they're calling or why they are where

385
00:14:55,710 --> 00:14:52,930
they are yeah in their life

386
00:14:57,800 --> 00:14:55,720
yeah actually there was own remember

387
00:15:00,180 --> 00:14:57,810
taking a call from a woman once who was

388
00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:00,190
for lack of a better word freaking out

389
00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:02,770
about 9/11 and saying like I can't walk

390
00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:04,570
down the street and see Muslim people

391
00:15:10,860 --> 00:15:07,090
with their garb it makes me get PTSD and

392
00:15:12,990 --> 00:15:10,870
afraid and it's unfortunate this is

393
00:15:14,700 --> 00:15:13,000
really interesting too obviously I'm not

394
00:15:17,430 --> 00:15:14,710
going to name any names a hotline is

395
00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:17,440
confidential but we had um a gentleman

396
00:15:21,510 --> 00:15:20,290
who used to call every day as soon as

397
00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:21,520
you pick up the phone he would just say

398
00:15:25,410 --> 00:15:23,290
9/11 was an inside job and he started

399
00:15:27,870 --> 00:15:25,420
ranting and raving about it I spoke to

400
00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:27,880
him a number of times and this was not

401
00:15:32,190 --> 00:15:30,610
planned or arranged but I went to that

402
00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:32,200
event at Cooper Union that we talked

403
00:15:36,330 --> 00:15:33,130
about a few minutes ago

404
00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:36,340
and after the fact he called the hotline

405
00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:39,370
again and told me that he was there and

406
00:15:43,680 --> 00:15:41,410
told me yeah I was the guy with the

407
00:15:45,690 --> 00:15:43,690
black plastic bag putting all the DVDs

408
00:15:48,990 --> 00:15:45,700
in it I'm like who actually saw the guys

409
00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:49,000
buying DVD books and actually kind of

410
00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:51,370
being annoying making kind of a ruckus

411
00:15:57,480 --> 00:15:53,170
with the bag and they had to ask them to

412
00:15:59,270 --> 00:15:57,490
be quiet and well I imagine you get you

413
00:16:01,950 --> 00:15:59,280
get all different types of people there

414
00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:01,960
we get all kinds of people Nick I'll be

415
00:16:08,190 --> 00:16:04,930
honest with you I don't say this to be a

416
00:16:09,870 --> 00:16:08,200
jerk but I actually dislike a large

417
00:16:13,020 --> 00:16:09,880
percentage of the people that I meet in

418
00:16:14,490 --> 00:16:13,030
the 9/11 truth movement to be honest not

419
00:16:17,250 --> 00:16:14,500
although I mean I've met some really

420
00:16:18,510 --> 00:16:17,260
great level-headed intelligent people

421
00:16:21,150 --> 00:16:18,520
but I've also have met a lot of people

422
00:16:23,430 --> 00:16:21,160
who just latch on to anything they hear

423
00:16:25,620 --> 00:16:23,440
in any of these films or whatever and

424
00:16:27,300 --> 00:16:25,630
just take it as Dogma and get

425
00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:27,310
belligerent when you try to argue with

426
00:16:30,620 --> 00:16:29,290
them about it we have one guy who comes

427
00:16:34,579 --> 00:16:30,630
to our meetings

428
00:16:38,900 --> 00:16:34,589
sometimes and he's a no planer which I'm

429
00:16:41,300 --> 00:16:38,910
not and one day he was telling me it's

430
00:16:42,949 --> 00:16:41,310
physically impossible for a plane to

431
00:16:45,530 --> 00:16:42,959
penetrate the World Trade Center and all

432
00:16:47,420 --> 00:16:45,540
I said to him was okay well can you show

433
00:16:49,490 --> 00:16:47,430
me some calculations to substantiate

434
00:16:51,199 --> 00:16:49,500
that claim and he just got really

435
00:16:54,170 --> 00:16:51,209
belligerent and started yelling at me

436
00:16:56,990 --> 00:16:54,180
and you know and yeah what does that

437
00:16:57,980 --> 00:16:57,000
come on yeah I think that's slow yeah

438
00:16:59,930 --> 00:16:57,990
okay what we're saying earlier with

439
00:17:03,800 --> 00:16:59,940
common sense like some people think that

440
00:17:05,179 --> 00:17:03,810
it's it's obvious the plane couldn't you

441
00:17:07,309 --> 00:17:05,189
know penetrate the World Trade Center

442
00:17:09,079 --> 00:17:07,319
because they think you know outside was

443
00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:09,089
made of steel and the plane was made of

444
00:17:13,699 --> 00:17:10,890
aluminum and aluminum is softer than

445
00:17:15,559 --> 00:17:13,709
steel therefore it couldn't go through

446
00:17:18,380 --> 00:17:15,569
the steel well there's this little thing

447
00:17:20,270 --> 00:17:18,390
called velocity Nick a paint chip can

448
00:17:23,120 --> 00:17:20,280
crack a windshield if it's moving fast

449
00:17:25,939 --> 00:17:23,130
enough maybe the example I often give is

450
00:17:28,130 --> 00:17:25,949
a ping-pong ball if you shoot a

451
00:17:30,500 --> 00:17:28,140
ping-pong ball fast enough it will go

452
00:17:32,149 --> 00:17:30,510
through a ping-pong paddle when

453
00:17:34,190 --> 00:17:32,159
obviously a ping-pong paddle is designed

454
00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:34,200
very much to not have ping-pong balls go

455
00:17:37,279 --> 00:17:35,850
through it and it's it's obviously a

456
00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:37,289
thousand times stronger than a ping-pong

457
00:17:42,169 --> 00:17:37,890
ball

458
00:17:45,350 --> 00:17:42,179
at supersonic speed

459
00:17:48,620 --> 00:17:45,360
okay you blow a neat little hole into

460
00:17:50,390 --> 00:17:48,630
the ping-pong paddle what's the formula

461
00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:50,400
for the force equals mass times

462
00:17:54,789 --> 00:17:51,450
acceleration

463
00:17:58,570 --> 00:17:54,799
yeah F equals MA that it's more about

464
00:18:00,980 --> 00:17:58,580
kinetic energy the energy is

465
00:18:03,470 --> 00:18:00,990
proportional to the mass times the

466
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:03,480
square of the velocity so if you go

467
00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:05,010
twice as fast you've got four times as

468
00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:07,530
much energy and when something hits

469
00:18:11,750 --> 00:18:08,850
something that energy has to go

470
00:18:14,990 --> 00:18:11,760
somewhere so a plane that weighs over

471
00:18:17,270 --> 00:18:15,000
400 turns going up like 400 to 500 miles

472
00:18:20,060 --> 00:18:17,280
an hour has a vast amount of energy and

473
00:18:21,799 --> 00:18:20,070
when it hits the side of the building

474
00:18:24,950 --> 00:18:21,809
the energy has to go somewhere yeah I

475
00:18:27,320 --> 00:18:24,960
think if people they do the common sense

476
00:18:29,060 --> 00:18:27,330
thing and the end they say it's obvious

477
00:18:30,950 --> 00:18:29,070
that this couldn't happen it looks like

478
00:18:33,320 --> 00:18:30,960
it just looks ridiculous it doesn't make

479
00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:33,330
any sense to physics but they don't go

480
00:18:39,020 --> 00:18:36,450
beyond the the base level they they just

481
00:18:42,080 --> 00:18:39,030
take that first thing and then they stop

482
00:18:44,180 --> 00:18:42,090
at that point and then if you try to

483
00:18:46,009 --> 00:18:44,190
raise more objections to there

484
00:18:47,389 --> 00:18:46,019
argument or show them something else

485
00:18:49,490 --> 00:18:47,399
they just rejected because they've

486
00:18:50,960 --> 00:18:49,500
already arrived at the conclusion and

487
00:18:53,330 --> 00:18:50,970
they don't feel any needs to go any

488
00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:53,340
further so he makes it very very typical

489
00:18:57,710 --> 00:18:56,250
Munich 8 it's frustrating it's

490
00:19:00,289 --> 00:18:57,720
frustrating even for me and I'm part of

491
00:19:02,180 --> 00:19:00,299
the movement okay I can't stand dealing

492
00:19:05,649 --> 00:19:02,190
with people like that it's in serious

493
00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:05,659
you know it is to me it's kind of like

494
00:19:10,700 --> 00:19:08,730
winning a game because you cheated right

495
00:19:13,070 --> 00:19:10,710
you didn't really win the game so if we

496
00:19:14,629 --> 00:19:13,080
convince people or something and shut

497
00:19:16,519 --> 00:19:14,639
ourselves off to their questions and

498
00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:16,529
problems with it it's kind of like

499
00:19:20,960 --> 00:19:18,210
winning the debate by cheating and you

500
00:19:22,879 --> 00:19:20,970
didn't really win yeah I've actually had

501
00:19:24,980 --> 00:19:22,889
people like you know they make

502
00:19:27,889 --> 00:19:24,990
essentially semantic arguments I they

503
00:19:29,659 --> 00:19:27,899
will say chemtrails are real because jet

504
00:19:31,639 --> 00:19:29,669
engine exhaust has chemicals in it and

505
00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:31,649
they leave trails sometimes and that

506
00:19:33,590 --> 00:19:32,850
must be a chem trail because it's a

507
00:19:36,830 --> 00:19:33,600
chemical trail

508
00:19:38,930 --> 00:19:36,840
therefore chemtrails are real it's

509
00:19:40,669 --> 00:19:38,940
almost like the muroids in winning the

510
00:19:42,889 --> 00:19:40,679
argument by some kind of semantic thing

511
00:19:45,379 --> 00:19:42,899
that they are in actually discovering

512
00:19:48,710 --> 00:19:45,389
what's actually going on it's almost

513
00:19:52,249 --> 00:19:48,720
like a kind of a contest or a game to

514
00:19:54,259 --> 00:19:52,259
try to decide who who wins yeah there's

515
00:19:57,200 --> 00:19:54,269
a lot of X going on with with these 9/11

516
00:20:00,799 --> 00:19:57,210
debates and not to not to pick on you

517
00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:00,809
but you're kind of unique to me and as a

518
00:20:04,129 --> 00:20:03,090
debunker because a lot of the bunkers if

519
00:20:06,590 --> 00:20:04,139
they were going to have me on a show

520
00:20:08,539 --> 00:20:06,600
like this or saw a podcast like this the

521
00:20:10,970 --> 00:20:08,549
goal isn't really to have an intelligent

522
00:20:12,980 --> 00:20:10,980
discussion and come to truth and

523
00:20:15,169 --> 00:20:12,990
understanding the goal is just to make

524
00:20:17,180 --> 00:20:15,179
the 9/11 truther look like an idiot yeah

525
00:20:20,210 --> 00:20:17,190
well I certainly I would agree with that

526
00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:20,220
with a lot of the Flat Earth debunking

527
00:20:21,889 --> 00:20:20,730
stuff

528
00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:21,899
yeah I'm not comparing the two I'm

529
00:20:25,850 --> 00:20:23,970
comparing the debunkers here like I you

530
00:20:26,869 --> 00:20:25,860
see these these flutter of things and

531
00:20:28,610 --> 00:20:26,879
they just make you find out the flutter

532
00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:28,620
'this all the time and you yes you do

533
00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:30,330
very well on on youtube they have

534
00:20:34,129 --> 00:20:32,970
channels with quite a lot of views but I

535
00:20:38,450 --> 00:20:34,139
don't know if there actually are that

536
00:20:41,210 --> 00:20:38,460
many 9/11 debunkers nowadays I mean do

537
00:20:44,810 --> 00:20:41,220
you do you know of anybody who does like

538
00:20:46,100 --> 00:20:44,820
9/11 debunking talk shows or podcasts or

539
00:20:50,659 --> 00:20:46,110
anything like that because I'm not

540
00:20:52,820 --> 00:20:50,669
really familiar with well yeah I guess

541
00:20:54,529 --> 00:20:52,830
yeah I think that a few years ago I'd

542
00:20:56,680 --> 00:20:54,539
probably say yeah the whole bunch of

543
00:20:58,770 --> 00:20:56,690
them who kind of died down a little bit

544
00:21:09,150 --> 00:20:58,780
I mean we had Popular Mechanics we had

545
00:21:14,110 --> 00:21:11,560
there's a thing there's a thing in the

546
00:21:17,410 --> 00:21:14,120
movement ability line is to let go of

547
00:21:20,170 --> 00:21:17,420
something when it's been demonstrated to

548
00:21:23,110 --> 00:21:20,180
be false an example would be the

549
00:21:24,850 --> 00:21:23,120
Pentagon right you have the sense that a

550
00:21:27,790 --> 00:21:24,860
plane didn't hit the Pentagon because

551
00:21:28,900 --> 00:21:27,800
the hole is too small and I mean just

552
00:21:30,580 --> 00:21:28,910
look at the picture that doesn't

553
00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:30,590
misleading picture if you really look at

554
00:21:35,530 --> 00:21:33,290
the broad spectrum of the photos that

555
00:21:36,700 --> 00:21:35,540
I've taken there that gash is like a

556
00:21:38,230 --> 00:21:36,710
hundred feet wide

557
00:21:39,910 --> 00:21:38,240
that's very interesting as actually I

558
00:21:41,350 --> 00:21:39,920
was gonna ask you specifically about

559
00:21:43,540 --> 00:21:41,360
that that thing because it's something

560
00:21:45,940 --> 00:21:43,550
that comes up a lot like people say the

561
00:21:47,770 --> 00:21:45,950
hole in the Pentagon was too small he

562
00:21:49,750 --> 00:21:47,780
hear this a lot over and over from

563
00:21:52,330 --> 00:21:49,760
people who don't think that a plane hit

564
00:21:54,670 --> 00:21:52,340
the Pentagon and then you share them the

565
00:21:56,890 --> 00:21:54,680
pictures of it and you share them like

566
00:21:59,620 --> 00:21:56,900
the bits on either side where the wing

567
00:22:01,780 --> 00:21:59,630
was hit the column and they'll reject it

568
00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:01,790
and it's kind of hard to know what to do

569
00:22:05,380 --> 00:22:03,650
with someone who even when you're

570
00:22:08,740 --> 00:22:05,390
showing them something like that you

571
00:22:09,940 --> 00:22:08,750
show them the actual plane overlaid with

572
00:22:12,220 --> 00:22:09,950
the hole and you show that it could

573
00:22:13,780 --> 00:22:12,230
quite easily of fit through the hole

574
00:22:17,860 --> 00:22:13,790
with the ends of the wings obviously

575
00:22:20,020 --> 00:22:17,870
snaps off yeah do you talk to people who

576
00:22:22,260 --> 00:22:20,030
are like no plane hit the Pentagon type

577
00:22:25,030 --> 00:22:22,270
people within the community

578
00:22:26,860 --> 00:22:25,040
it's frustrating because they just don't

579
00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:26,870
listen the reason they just cling to

580
00:22:31,750 --> 00:22:30,050
that belief like it's it's crazy and you

581
00:22:34,630 --> 00:22:31,760
know here's another observation I have

582
00:22:36,630 --> 00:22:34,640
the truth is one at both ways they saved

583
00:22:39,250 --> 00:22:36,640
the testimony of Norman Mineta as

584
00:22:40,690 --> 00:22:39,260
evidence of a stand-down of a plane

585
00:22:44,490 --> 00:22:40,700
approaching the Pentagon but then they

586
00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:44,500
said there was no plane right I mean

587
00:22:49,150 --> 00:22:46,970
this conspiracy theory study I think

588
00:22:51,070 --> 00:22:49,160
that where people were asked about

589
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:51,080
various conspiracy theories and asked

590
00:22:54,850 --> 00:22:53,450
which ones they believed I can't

591
00:22:57,280 --> 00:22:54,860
remember who it was exactly but say it

592
00:22:59,770 --> 00:22:57,290
was JFK they said like one theory is

593
00:23:04,050 --> 00:22:59,780
that JFK faked his own death and he's

594
00:23:07,420 --> 00:23:04,060
still alive and the other theory is that

595
00:23:08,500 --> 00:23:07,430
JFK was assassinated by the CIA I think

596
00:23:10,230 --> 00:23:08,510
was actually about somebody else but

597
00:23:11,910 --> 00:23:10,240
it's the same same basic thing like

598
00:23:13,470 --> 00:23:11,920
this person was you know there's two

599
00:23:16,049 --> 00:23:13,480
theories about this person one in which

600
00:23:17,850 --> 00:23:16,059
you he was dead and when she was still

601
00:23:20,010 --> 00:23:17,860
alive and they were asked how much they

602
00:23:22,799 --> 00:23:20,020
believed either of these theories and

603
00:23:25,710 --> 00:23:22,809
they were about 90 percent for both

604
00:23:27,750 --> 00:23:25,720
theories which means that they

605
00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:27,760
simultaneously believed it was highly

606
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:29,650
plausible that he faked his death and

607
00:23:36,540 --> 00:23:32,250
highly plausible by almost certain that

608
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:36,550
he he he was dead they they kind of

609
00:23:40,919 --> 00:23:38,050
simultaneously believe someone he was

610
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:40,929
like Schrodinger's conspiracy theory but

611
00:23:47,340 --> 00:23:43,450
yeah you you get people wanting to

612
00:23:49,020 --> 00:23:47,350
believe things because they are they fit

613
00:23:51,510 --> 00:23:49,030
the worldview even if they don't fit

614
00:23:53,940 --> 00:23:51,520
each other either if they could believe

615
00:23:56,190 --> 00:23:53,950
ten different things they don't have to

616
00:23:59,430 --> 00:23:56,200
fit together but if each individually

617
00:24:03,150 --> 00:23:59,440
fits the worldview then that one thing

618
00:24:05,060 --> 00:24:03,160
by itself becomes yeah attractive to

619
00:24:08,730 --> 00:24:05,070
them and it doesn't matter that it

620
00:24:11,220 --> 00:24:08,740
contradicts with with other things in in

621
00:24:12,630 --> 00:24:11,230
their belief system you know there are

622
00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:12,640
people I'm not gonna mention any names

623
00:24:19,740 --> 00:24:15,730
here but there are people very high up

624
00:24:21,299 --> 00:24:19,750
in the 9/11 truth movement who still I'm

625
00:24:23,190 --> 00:24:21,309
not talking about just your average Joe

626
00:24:24,510 --> 00:24:23,200
truth or from down the block I'm talking

627
00:24:26,340 --> 00:24:24,520
about some of the big names and the

628
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:26,350
movement that you've heard of yeah it

629
00:24:32,030 --> 00:24:29,290
has still push this missile hit the

630
00:24:34,860 --> 00:24:32,040
Pentagon theory and have ostracized

631
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:34,870
other people in the movement for not

632
00:24:39,450 --> 00:24:37,450
agreeing with that and that's really

633
00:24:41,100 --> 00:24:39,460
reprehensible to me especially since

634
00:24:43,620 --> 00:24:41,110
some of those people who have been

635
00:24:45,540 --> 00:24:43,630
ostracized for not believing that have

636
00:24:47,010 --> 00:24:45,550
more technical credentials and knowledge

637
00:24:50,340 --> 00:24:47,020
than the people who are ostracized in

638
00:24:52,890 --> 00:24:50,350
them yeah I know David Chandler is

639
00:24:55,770 --> 00:24:52,900
someone who I just think a plane hit the

640
00:24:58,110 --> 00:24:55,780
Pentagon he's the guy who's a former

641
00:25:00,360 --> 00:24:58,120
high school physics teacher who he's

642
00:25:03,030 --> 00:25:00,370
famous in the 911 community because he

643
00:25:05,340 --> 00:25:03,040
brought in this attention that there was

644
00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:05,350
a segment of free fall in the collapse

645
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:06,970
of World Trade Center building 7 and

646
00:25:13,740 --> 00:25:11,170
then NIST changed their reports to

647
00:25:15,150 --> 00:25:13,750
include that more detailed breakdown of

648
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:15,160
the collapse to include the freefall

649
00:25:20,510 --> 00:25:18,730
segments he's a famous of that but

650
00:25:23,370 --> 00:25:20,520
recently he spent a lot of time

651
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:23,380
debunking the idea that no plane hit the

652
00:25:26,170 --> 00:25:24,010
Pentagon

653
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:26,180
which is really interesting yeah honey

654
00:25:31,630 --> 00:25:28,850
and he has been ostracized for that yeah

655
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:31,640
by the movement and that to me is is sad

656
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:33,410
it's really sad I mean you got a guy

657
00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:36,170
here who's basically a rock star in the

658
00:25:42,250 --> 00:25:38,210
9/11 truth movement and then there

659
00:25:44,799 --> 00:25:42,260
ostracizing him for being truthful but

660
00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:44,809
the Pentagon and some of the people that

661
00:25:48,670 --> 00:25:46,970
are responsible for that ostracizing of

662
00:25:51,250 --> 00:25:48,680
him like I said not going to name their

663
00:25:53,049 --> 00:25:51,260
names but they're but pretty high up in

664
00:25:54,490 --> 00:25:53,059
the movement and that's yeah that's

665
00:25:56,650 --> 00:25:54,500
disturbing to me that's really

666
00:25:58,810 --> 00:25:56,660
disturbing yeah yeah yeah I don't know

667
00:26:01,000 --> 00:25:58,820
like you know dig into that in terms of

668
00:26:02,890 --> 00:26:01,010
life you know naming names but like that

669
00:26:05,230 --> 00:26:02,900
the lawyers Committee they they recently

670
00:26:08,260 --> 00:26:05,240
published like a youtube video about

671
00:26:09,190 --> 00:26:08,270
flight 93 and how they thought it was a

672
00:26:11,530 --> 00:26:09,200
shot to down

673
00:26:13,930 --> 00:26:11,540
flight 93 is the plane that crashed into

674
00:26:16,660 --> 00:26:13,940
the field in Shanksville buried itself

675
00:26:19,360 --> 00:26:16,670
in the ground and a lot of people think

676
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:19,370
that's it also is very suspicious yeah

677
00:26:22,660 --> 00:26:20,690
it took to my mind it's like you know

678
00:26:25,090 --> 00:26:22,670
similar thing to the Pentagon he just it

679
00:26:26,470 --> 00:26:25,100
looks on because he was going so yeah it

680
00:26:28,780 --> 00:26:26,480
looks like a small hole when it was just

681
00:26:30,070 --> 00:26:28,790
buried itself underground but there's

682
00:26:31,570 --> 00:26:30,080
like a few things that people bring up

683
00:26:33,610 --> 00:26:31,580
like to say oh there was debris found

684
00:26:35,770 --> 00:26:33,620
around miles away and things like that

685
00:26:37,900 --> 00:26:35,780
and they say that means yeah probably

686
00:26:40,450 --> 00:26:37,910
probably shut that shot down I haven't

687
00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:40,460
researched 593 so I don't I don't really

688
00:26:45,460 --> 00:26:42,050
make assertions about it and my

689
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:45,470
suspicion is that it was shot down but I

690
00:26:49,030 --> 00:26:47,690
don't say that with any conviction Ares

691
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:49,040
because I haven't researched it yeah

692
00:26:53,290 --> 00:26:51,050
yeah well I think I always say to people

693
00:26:55,169 --> 00:26:53,300
if if you think it was shot down look at

694
00:26:58,200 --> 00:26:55,179
other planes that have been shot down

695
00:27:01,330 --> 00:26:58,210
when a plane gets shot down it actually

696
00:27:04,660 --> 00:27:01,340
disintegrates in the air and the debris

697
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:04,670
is spread over many many square miles if

698
00:27:09,850 --> 00:27:06,650
you remember a plane was shot down over

699
00:27:12,850 --> 00:27:09,860
the Ukraine probably by the Russians a

700
00:27:14,650 --> 00:27:12,860
few years ago and there's lots of

701
00:27:16,060 --> 00:27:14,660
pictures of that and you can see what

702
00:27:18,820 --> 00:27:16,070
having a plane actually gets shot down

703
00:27:22,330 --> 00:27:18,830
and it didn't look like a hole at the

704
00:27:24,310 --> 00:27:22,340
ground you know yeah let me ask you

705
00:27:26,380 --> 00:27:24,320
something about Shanksville and I'm just

706
00:27:27,460 --> 00:27:26,390
I'm just asking I'm not I don't know the

707
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:27,470
answer and I'm planning I know the

708
00:27:30,970 --> 00:27:28,610
answer it's not a rhetorical question

709
00:27:32,810 --> 00:27:30,980
I'm looking for the answer what do you

710
00:27:34,999 --> 00:27:32,820
make of this um

711
00:27:36,529 --> 00:27:35,009
quote from Wiley Miller that's often

712
00:27:37,909 --> 00:27:36,539
thrown around the corner

713
00:27:39,259 --> 00:27:37,919
yeah where he says he didn't see a

714
00:27:41,210 --> 00:27:39,269
single drop of blood there were no

715
00:27:44,299 --> 00:27:41,220
bodies I heard that he came out later

716
00:27:47,810 --> 00:27:44,309
and said that he was not misquoted but

717
00:27:49,490 --> 00:27:47,820
he was misrepresented he's curious what

718
00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:49,500
do you know anything about that yeah no

719
00:27:52,789 --> 00:27:51,210
I I don't know the specifics of it but

720
00:27:54,259 --> 00:27:52,799
you know taken by it even by it just

721
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:54,269
second by itself it doesn't sound that

722
00:27:58,180 --> 00:27:56,250
at a place to me because you could

723
00:28:01,399 --> 00:27:58,190
remember what happened to the plane is

724
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:01,409
it wasn't a typical plane crash you know

725
00:28:05,749 --> 00:28:03,570
normal plane crash the flame breaks up

726
00:28:07,879 --> 00:28:05,759
as it's hitting the ground at fairly low

727
00:28:10,279 --> 00:28:07,889
speed and it's going like parallel to

728
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:10,289
the ground and so you get bodies and

729
00:28:16,310 --> 00:28:12,690
body parts scattered everywhere

730
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:16,320
one moment here is the plane went almost

731
00:28:19,490 --> 00:28:17,970
straight down and like thinking like a

732
00:28:22,279 --> 00:28:19,500
50 degree angle or something like that

733
00:28:25,369 --> 00:28:22,289
and it buried itself in the ground and

734
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:25,379
the the fuselage was all compressed like

735
00:28:30,019 --> 00:28:27,090
you know like stomping on a Koki cam

736
00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:30,029
type thing except it horrible to think

737
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:33,330
like people inside and so everything

738
00:28:38,299 --> 00:28:35,490
pretty much ended up underground the

739
00:28:40,820 --> 00:28:38,309
words your body is being thrown free

740
00:28:44,139 --> 00:28:40,830
like you would think of in in a small

741
00:28:48,619 --> 00:28:44,149
plane crash or a plane being shot down

742
00:28:52,909 --> 00:28:48,629
there's metal in crash in Iran yesterday

743
00:28:55,820 --> 00:28:52,919
and the surface of that and you see you

744
00:28:59,299 --> 00:28:55,830
know intact bodies because essentially

745
00:29:01,519 --> 00:28:59,309
it's it wasn't flown to into the ground

746
00:29:03,289 --> 00:29:01,529
at high speed it just just crashed and

747
00:29:04,999 --> 00:29:03,299
when planes crash it usually means that

748
00:29:07,759 --> 00:29:05,009
they're going below that aerodynamic

749
00:29:09,259 --> 00:29:07,769
speed which for a plane is like about a

750
00:29:10,820 --> 00:29:09,269
hundred and fifty miles an hour

751
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:10,830
something like that

752
00:29:14,690 --> 00:29:12,330
below that they're going to stall and

753
00:29:16,519 --> 00:29:14,700
fall out of the sky so either it's you

754
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:16,529
know they have some kind of equipment

755
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:18,090
failure which makes them stall and fall

756
00:29:23,269 --> 00:29:21,210
out of the sky or they're they're hit by

757
00:29:25,310 --> 00:29:23,279
something and they break up in the sky

758
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:25,320
either way like it's a difference

759
00:29:29,629 --> 00:29:26,850
between a 500 mile per hour crash

760
00:29:32,539 --> 00:29:29,639
straight down and a 100 mile per hour

761
00:29:34,580 --> 00:29:32,549
crash is it's quite substantial like in

762
00:29:37,820 --> 00:29:34,590
the in the one you get her this thing

763
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:37,830
with a plane just like penetrates into

764
00:29:43,610 --> 00:29:41,010
pretty much whatever it hits and in the

765
00:29:46,580 --> 00:29:43,620
other you get it just breaking up and

766
00:29:49,130 --> 00:29:46,590
you get you will get intact bodies

767
00:29:52,310 --> 00:29:49,140
you know just basically laying around so

768
00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:52,320
this there's a huge difference so you

769
00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:54,570
know his his statements this coroner's

770
00:29:58,640 --> 00:29:56,250
statement is just what he said about

771
00:30:01,190 --> 00:29:58,650
what he saw when he first arrived at the

772
00:30:02,420 --> 00:30:01,200
scene he essentially saw what other

773
00:30:03,770 --> 00:30:02,430
people saw and what you see in the

774
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:03,780
pictures which is a big hole in the

775
00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:07,530
ground and the plain hands the bodies

776
00:30:12,620 --> 00:30:11,130
were in that hole so he would see all my

777
00:30:14,690 --> 00:30:12,630
body parts later obviously when they

778
00:30:15,950 --> 00:30:14,700
were dug out and you probably wouldn't

779
00:30:18,380 --> 00:30:15,960
take that much digging to get to the

780
00:30:22,030 --> 00:30:18,390
first one but yeah the first day when he

781
00:30:25,730 --> 00:30:22,040
arrived there that's what he saw yeah

782
00:30:27,500 --> 00:30:25,740
the World Trade Center make sure I don't

783
00:30:30,230 --> 00:30:27,510
know much about 593 I wanna spend too

784
00:30:31,490 --> 00:30:30,240
much time on that but um here's

785
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:31,500
something that's kind of interesting to

786
00:30:35,030 --> 00:30:33,450
me and maybe you can you can give me

787
00:30:37,040 --> 00:30:35,040
your your thoughts on this your your

788
00:30:38,750 --> 00:30:37,050
response I'm sure everybody's heard

789
00:30:40,010 --> 00:30:38,760
about interview with John skilling in

790
00:30:43,220 --> 00:30:40,020
the Seattle Times right

791
00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:43,230
from 1993 where he said that he the

792
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:45,450
buildings were designed to withstand the

793
00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:50,090
plane yes okay so in addition to that

794
00:30:59,240 --> 00:30:54,770
I've seen multiple clips video clips

795
00:31:01,190 --> 00:30:59,250
from way before 9/11 mm-hmm there's a

796
00:31:03,350 --> 00:31:01,200
video from the late 70s or early 80s

797
00:31:05,210 --> 00:31:03,360
where a guy explained what would happen

798
00:31:07,850 --> 00:31:05,220
if a plane hit the Twin Towers and how

799
00:31:10,220 --> 00:31:07,860
an intense grid kind of like a mosquito

800
00:31:12,890 --> 00:31:10,230
net yeah in the plane they're just a

801
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:12,900
pencil puncturing that net it really

802
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:14,250
does nothing to the integrity of the

803
00:31:17,930 --> 00:31:16,650
structure it's interesting to me that

804
00:31:21,860 --> 00:31:17,940
you're hearing this from multiple

805
00:31:24,110 --> 00:31:21,870
sources like so long before 9/11 kind of

806
00:31:26,450 --> 00:31:24,120
lend some credibility to it to me it's

807
00:31:27,410 --> 00:31:26,460
true I mean it's very very true and

808
00:31:31,010 --> 00:31:27,420
that's what happened

809
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:31,020
if you think think to the videos of the

810
00:31:35,210 --> 00:31:32,970
planes hitting the World Trade Center

811
00:31:36,410 --> 00:31:35,220
they just you know from a distance it

812
00:31:38,630 --> 00:31:36,420
almost looks like they're melted into

813
00:31:40,460 --> 00:31:38,640
them when you see it closer up you see

814
00:31:41,900 --> 00:31:40,470
that the hole that they formed but

815
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:41,910
that's really what happened the

816
00:31:45,650 --> 00:31:44,130
structure of the building did what it

817
00:31:48,050 --> 00:31:45,660
was supposed to do when it was designed

818
00:31:50,870 --> 00:31:48,060
to do which is withstand an impact like

819
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:50,880
that and and it did it sounds killing

820
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:52,530
took the fire into account as well the

821
00:31:56,450 --> 00:31:54,450
exact quote I believe is the biggest

822
00:31:57,890 --> 00:31:56,460
problem would be that all the fuel from

823
00:31:59,660 --> 00:31:57,900
the plane would dump into the building

824
00:32:01,820 --> 00:31:59,670
if I happened there would be a her end

825
00:32:03,380 --> 00:32:01,830
fire a lot of people would be killed but

826
00:32:05,990 --> 00:32:03,390
the building structure would still be

827
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:06,000
there yeah so he was right about the

828
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:09,090
first thing and that the building was it

829
00:32:12,010 --> 00:32:10,890
would withstand the impact and that's a

830
00:32:14,420 --> 00:32:12,020
fairly straightforward thing to

831
00:32:16,970 --> 00:32:14,430
calculate because he is talking about an

832
00:32:18,710 --> 00:32:16,980
instantaneous redistribution of loads so

833
00:32:20,750 --> 00:32:18,720
that when the planes hit the buildings

834
00:32:22,790 --> 00:32:20,760
they swayed a bit from one side to the

835
00:32:24,470 --> 00:32:22,800
other I think the top of the building

836
00:32:27,230 --> 00:32:24,480
now the calculated it probably moved

837
00:32:28,940 --> 00:32:27,240
like like nine inches or so and yeah

838
00:32:30,530 --> 00:32:28,950
continue to sway a little bit I believe

839
00:32:33,260 --> 00:32:30,540
that there are reports of people saying

840
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:33,270
the building will swing but that that

841
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:36,330
was fine here that that all work what

842
00:32:42,500 --> 00:32:40,290
didn't work was the fire ended up doing

843
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:42,510
more damage then I guess they thought

844
00:32:48,260 --> 00:32:45,770
now I've seen a clip of Shyamsundar

845
00:32:50,690 --> 00:32:48,270
saying the building's wouldn't have

846
00:32:53,150 --> 00:32:50,700
collapsed from the plains and the fires

847
00:32:54,980 --> 00:32:53,160
and the reason that they did was because

848
00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:54,990
the fire proofing was dislodged

849
00:32:58,610 --> 00:32:56,850
yes I've never really come across any

850
00:33:00,020 --> 00:32:58,620
proof of that claim that the fire

851
00:33:02,090 --> 00:33:00,030
proofing was dislodged and I heard a

852
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:02,100
pretty interesting argument against it

853
00:33:04,790 --> 00:33:03,570
which was related to what you were

854
00:33:06,980 --> 00:33:04,800
talking about with the building swing

855
00:33:08,690 --> 00:33:06,990
mm-hmm and so the eye the eye witness

856
00:33:12,230 --> 00:33:08,700
testimony is that the building didn't

857
00:33:14,510 --> 00:33:12,240
kind of vibrate so much as it swayed all

858
00:33:18,290 --> 00:33:14,520
the way to one side and then swayed back

859
00:33:23,150 --> 00:33:18,300
the other way rather slowly well that's

860
00:33:26,330 --> 00:33:23,160
what you expect right if you please laws

861
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:26,340
away in US you know you're not gonna get

862
00:33:29,030 --> 00:33:28,170
some kind of sudden movements of the

863
00:33:32,540 --> 00:33:29,040
entire tower

864
00:33:34,010 --> 00:33:32,550
I wouldn't expect the whole building to

865
00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:34,020
suddenly shift to one side that doesn't

866
00:33:38,900 --> 00:33:35,370
make any sense at all because nothing's

867
00:33:41,300 --> 00:33:38,910
so heavy and the plane come here is is a

868
00:33:43,100 --> 00:33:41,310
tiny fraction of that that amount do you

869
00:33:46,220 --> 00:33:43,110
think if you you'd have to imagine like

870
00:33:49,340 --> 00:33:46,230
a I don't know a 200 pound window screen

871
00:33:51,230 --> 00:33:49,350
and then you poke a pen through it but I

872
00:33:53,690 --> 00:33:51,240
say throwing the pen at this 200 pound

873
00:33:56,950 --> 00:33:53,700
window screen yeah you can penetrate it

874
00:34:00,200 --> 00:33:56,960
but it's not going to make you move

875
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:00,210
right so but you ask you about the

876
00:34:06,170 --> 00:34:03,690
dislodging of the the fireproofing now

877
00:34:08,450 --> 00:34:06,180
all all steel frame buildings have to

878
00:34:09,650 --> 00:34:08,460
have fire proofing around the steel

879
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:09,660
otherwise they're extraordinarily

880
00:34:13,639 --> 00:34:13,050
vulnerable to fire because steel beam

881
00:34:16,249 --> 00:34:13,649
can heat

882
00:34:18,769 --> 00:34:16,259
up in a matter of minutes with a strong

883
00:34:20,059 --> 00:34:18,779
enough fire and once it was heated up it

884
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:20,069
loses all the strength of bail so they

885
00:34:25,849 --> 00:34:23,970
all had this fire proofing on so I've

886
00:34:28,509 --> 00:34:25,859
heard richard gage asked this question

887
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:28,519
and his response was unimpressive but

888
00:34:35,119 --> 00:34:32,249
see the question was you know if if

889
00:34:37,159 --> 00:34:35,129
steel can can handle fire why do we

890
00:34:38,869 --> 00:34:37,169
bother using fire proofing Richards and

891
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:38,879
he didn't really have an answer for that

892
00:34:43,460 --> 00:34:41,970
but my question then becomes you know

893
00:34:45,559 --> 00:34:43,470
this means the fire provision that's

894
00:34:47,899 --> 00:34:45,569
used on these buildings typically gives

895
00:34:48,980 --> 00:34:47,909
you about two to three hours right so

896
00:34:52,099 --> 00:34:48,990
what about these buildings that have

897
00:34:53,139 --> 00:34:52,109
burned for like 17 18 20 hours surely

898
00:34:55,999 --> 00:34:53,149
the fire proofing

899
00:34:57,710 --> 00:34:56,009
is not a factor after the first few

900
00:35:00,140 --> 00:34:57,720
hours and yet the building continues to

901
00:35:02,599 --> 00:35:00,150
burn like a torch for several more hours

902
00:35:04,730 --> 00:35:02,609
and didn't client usually what happened

903
00:35:06,650 --> 00:35:04,740
is that the fire is moving from one part

904
00:35:10,370 --> 00:35:06,660
of the building to another you can't

905
00:35:14,690 --> 00:35:10,380
really have a building any fire burning

906
00:35:16,309 --> 00:35:14,700
in one spot for five hours right say in

907
00:35:17,420 --> 00:35:16,319
like 20 minutes plating you have us

908
00:35:19,460 --> 00:35:17,430
young-min or die

909
00:35:21,140 --> 00:35:19,470
yeah now you know obviously that will

910
00:35:24,170 --> 00:35:21,150
raise questions when we get to World

911
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:24,180
Trade Center building 7 but yeah when

912
00:35:29,420 --> 00:35:26,970
you see these building fires they

913
00:35:33,319 --> 00:35:29,430
typically don't like burn for that long

914
00:35:34,849 --> 00:35:33,329
in underneath one particular beam move

915
00:35:37,759 --> 00:35:34,859
from one spot to another

916
00:35:39,289 --> 00:35:37,769
now World Trade Center 7 which is the

917
00:35:42,589 --> 00:35:39,299
one people like to focus on you're

918
00:35:45,589 --> 00:35:42,599
definitely you can ya ask why you'd that

919
00:35:47,690 --> 00:35:45,599
one collapse when no other building in

920
00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:47,700
history has collapse well it's really

921
00:35:51,769 --> 00:35:49,170
kind of a set of extraordinary

922
00:35:55,099 --> 00:35:51,779
circumstances that caused it to collapse

923
00:36:00,440 --> 00:35:55,109
like first of all World Trade Center one

924
00:36:02,210 --> 00:36:00,450
the North Tower basically collapsed two

925
00:36:04,279 --> 00:36:02,220
blocks away from it

926
00:36:06,859 --> 00:36:04,289
took out most of the windows on the

927
00:36:08,900 --> 00:36:06,869
south side and did quite a chunk of

928
00:36:11,539 --> 00:36:08,910
damage to it and set a whole bunch of

929
00:36:13,249 --> 00:36:11,549
fires throughout the building the NIST

930
00:36:17,089 --> 00:36:13,259
report on building seven the final

931
00:36:18,890 --> 00:36:17,099
report states that neither the damage

932
00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:18,900
from World Trade Center one nor the fuel

933
00:36:22,729 --> 00:36:21,210
tanks in the bottom cleared any kind of

934
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:22,739
significant role in the class

935
00:36:26,650 --> 00:36:24,450
yeah but the damage from World Trade

936
00:36:29,770 --> 00:36:26,660
Center one is what caused the fires and

937
00:36:31,260 --> 00:36:29,780
it wasn't it wasn't as if that was the

938
00:36:33,580 --> 00:36:31,270
only thing that was going on that day

939
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:33,590
there were significant challenges in

940
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:36,170
fighting the fire by the firefighters

941
00:36:42,550 --> 00:36:38,930
and of course they eventually they they

942
00:36:43,870 --> 00:36:42,560
pulled out of the other thing [\h__\h] all

943
00:36:46,090 --> 00:36:43,880
right I got to ask you about this Nick

944
00:36:48,690 --> 00:36:46,100
and before I do I'm gonna preface it by

945
00:36:51,940 --> 00:36:48,700
saying that I'm well aware that

946
00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:51,950
eyewitness testimony is probably the

947
00:36:58,810 --> 00:36:55,610
weakest form of evidence there is but it

948
00:37:00,190 --> 00:36:58,820
is admissible in a court of law what do

949
00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:00,200
you make of this claim from Willie

950
00:37:05,380 --> 00:37:02,930
Rodriguez and about 20 other

951
00:37:07,060 --> 00:37:05,390
eyewitnesses to an explosion in the

952
00:37:09,510 --> 00:37:07,070
basement in the North Tower before the

953
00:37:12,670 --> 00:37:09,520
plane hit it gives a quite a detailed

954
00:37:14,260 --> 00:37:12,680
account of that and if you watch the

955
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:14,270
footage from the node a brothers

956
00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:16,090
documentary or any of the documentaries

957
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:18,610
look at the lobby in the North Tower the

958
00:37:24,430 --> 00:37:21,770
marble walls have blown off the windows

959
00:37:27,610 --> 00:37:24,440
3-inch glass green stick glass is blown

960
00:37:29,350 --> 00:37:27,620
out and I think the I think the official

961
00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:29,360
explanation is that it's the jet fuel

962
00:37:35,410 --> 00:37:31,970
pouring down the elevator shafts but I

963
00:37:36,700 --> 00:37:35,420
have a problem with that theory and I

964
00:37:38,140 --> 00:37:36,710
didn't come over this on my own it's

965
00:37:40,900 --> 00:37:38,150
actually in that film the new Pearl

966
00:37:42,130 --> 00:37:40,910
Harbor but it makes sense to me is that

967
00:37:45,580 --> 00:37:42,140
they're not taking into account the

968
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:45,590
volumes involved there the Twin Tower is

969
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:48,290
like something like a million cubic

970
00:37:53,770 --> 00:37:50,090
yards or cubic feet or something like

971
00:37:55,570 --> 00:37:53,780
that and the jet fuel first of all

972
00:37:58,750 --> 00:37:55,580
there's 10,000 gallons in each plane

973
00:38:00,580 --> 00:37:58,760
right kind of impact much of that is

974
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:00,590
burned off initially in the in the

975
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:03,890
fireball and it hits the tower some of

976
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:06,290
it has to be sprayed around and sparked

977
00:38:10,810 --> 00:38:08,930
fires yeah it's not really a whole lot

978
00:38:13,750 --> 00:38:10,820
of jet fuel left over to be pouring down

979
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:13,760
a thousand feet well I wish you add a

980
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:16,370
triangular mmm how much you think you

981
00:38:24,460 --> 00:38:22,390
the film shows an in scale graphic of

982
00:38:26,170 --> 00:38:24,470
what the volume of the jet shoe looks

983
00:38:27,700 --> 00:38:26,180
like next to the volume of the tower and

984
00:38:30,340 --> 00:38:27,710
they're kind of learning but we're

985
00:38:33,810 --> 00:38:30,350
talking here about the explosion in the

986
00:38:36,310 --> 00:38:33,820
lobby this is another bit of 9/11 truth

987
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:36,320
you know something that's commonly

988
00:38:40,300 --> 00:38:38,330
commonly repeated so there's this

989
00:38:42,310 --> 00:38:40,310
problem with why was there an explosion

990
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:42,320
in the lobby and the idea I guess is

991
00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:44,330
that there was perhaps an hurdle I'm not

992
00:38:49,630 --> 00:38:45,890
sure what people are suggesting what

993
00:38:51,340 --> 00:38:49,640
happened like there was a one of the pre

994
00:38:53,500 --> 00:38:51,350
planted explosives went off too early or

995
00:38:56,620 --> 00:38:53,510
something like that or was it you know

996
00:38:59,470 --> 00:38:56,630
the allegation is that okay when you do

997
00:39:00,790 --> 00:38:59,480
a controlled demolition right uh-huh not

998
00:39:02,860 --> 00:39:00,800
just the World Trade Center but any

999
00:39:06,490 --> 00:39:02,870
building has a large redundancy factor

1000
00:39:07,690 --> 00:39:06,500
so you can't just do the final sequence

1001
00:39:09,100 --> 00:39:07,700
right away and bring the building down

1002
00:39:11,230 --> 00:39:09,110
there's usually a series of preliminary

1003
00:39:13,350 --> 00:39:11,240
explosions that's necessary to weaken

1004
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:13,360
the building in the series that

1005
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:15,050
obviously they weren't going to detonate

1006
00:39:21,250 --> 00:39:18,410
those all next to each other so they

1007
00:39:22,750 --> 00:39:21,260
spaced them out I guess I don't think

1008
00:39:24,910 --> 00:39:22,760
miscalculated at the time and that one

1009
00:39:27,660 --> 00:39:24,920
went off too early but that that's

1010
00:39:29,950 --> 00:39:27,670
that's the allegation about the

1011
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:29,960
explosions that happened before the nest

1012
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:31,850
that makes any year do you think that's

1013
00:39:37,030 --> 00:39:34,810
a good theory that's worth consideration

1014
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:37,040
there are some videos of controlled

1015
00:39:41,350 --> 00:39:39,410
demolitions where they show that process

1016
00:39:42,550 --> 00:39:41,360
but that was a battery like about an

1017
00:39:45,970 --> 00:39:42,560
hour before the building actually

1018
00:39:48,370 --> 00:39:45,980
collapsed you don't see controlled

1019
00:39:50,380 --> 00:39:48,380
demolitions where they do one explosion

1020
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:50,390
and then wait an hour and then bring the

1021
00:39:54,730 --> 00:39:53,450
building down no I mean everybody knows

1022
00:39:56,410 --> 00:39:54,740
that if these were controlled

1023
00:39:59,380 --> 00:39:56,420
demolitions they were obviously unique

1024
00:40:01,990 --> 00:39:59,390
and I mean I don't think I don't think

1025
00:40:04,150 --> 00:40:02,000
if World Trade Center 7 was a demolition

1026
00:40:06,730 --> 00:40:04,160
I think it would have been the biggest

1027
00:40:08,680 --> 00:40:06,740
building ever demolished let's see maybe

1028
00:40:12,370 --> 00:40:08,690
we could do some like real time

1029
00:40:13,060 --> 00:40:12,380
debunking here like you know you hear

1030
00:40:14,950 --> 00:40:13,070
about this

1031
00:40:16,870 --> 00:40:14,960
this thing like the jet fueled down the

1032
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:16,880
elevator shaft and there wouldn't be

1033
00:40:24,570 --> 00:40:18,650
enough jet fuel to cause an explosion to

1034
00:40:28,630 --> 00:40:24,580
cause the damage in in in the lobby so

1035
00:40:32,380 --> 00:40:28,640
let's say let's try to figure out how

1036
00:40:33,849 --> 00:40:32,390
much jet fuel will be needed I

1037
00:40:36,370 --> 00:40:33,859
it wouldn't be that difficult like let's

1038
00:40:39,160 --> 00:40:36,380
say stay we replace the jet fuel with

1039
00:40:42,099 --> 00:40:39,170
dynamite how many sticks of Dynamite's

1040
00:40:45,130 --> 00:40:42,109
would it take to I think he's different

1041
00:40:47,019 --> 00:40:45,140
do that damn you know is that dynamite

1042
00:40:49,029 --> 00:40:47,029
just explodes as the Jets who was

1043
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:49,039
pouring down it's probably already on

1044
00:40:53,170 --> 00:40:50,930
fire and already burning as it's coming

1045
00:40:56,349 --> 00:40:53,180
down the elevators so it would be like a

1046
00:40:58,390 --> 00:40:56,359
essentially a fuel-air explosion where

1047
00:41:01,990 --> 00:40:58,400
the it would be atomized as it came down

1048
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:02,000
the shaft and then ignited when it you

1049
00:41:07,059 --> 00:41:03,890
know got to the bottom and it would I

1050
00:41:08,829 --> 00:41:07,069
guess like there the flame front would

1051
00:41:11,289 --> 00:41:08,839
come down the shaft all the way down to

1052
00:41:13,900 --> 00:41:11,299
be a big explosion of the fuel at the

1053
00:41:16,630 --> 00:41:13,910
bottom of the shaft well you know say

1054
00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:16,640
like some fuel got to the bottom and it

1055
00:41:20,500 --> 00:41:18,170
was splashing around so it's were kind

1056
00:41:21,730 --> 00:41:20,510
of all up in the air you know he fell

1057
00:41:23,049 --> 00:41:21,740
from the top so it's almost gonna be all

1058
00:41:24,609 --> 00:41:23,059
these tiny drops boat owner gets to the

1059
00:41:26,410 --> 00:41:24,619
bottom but it's just like let's just do

1060
00:41:30,670 --> 00:41:26,420
a real simple energy calculation I'm

1061
00:41:36,849 --> 00:41:30,680
gonna look up energy now fuel air

1062
00:41:38,079 --> 00:41:36,859
explosions you know how cars work they

1063
00:41:41,650 --> 00:41:38,089
you know I don't know anything about

1064
00:41:43,299 --> 00:41:41,660
cars we you seem I'm not joking I really

1065
00:41:45,069 --> 00:41:43,309
don't ya know if you you will have seen

1066
00:41:48,279 --> 00:41:45,079
at least like the basic you know you

1067
00:41:50,859 --> 00:41:48,289
know a car runs on gasoline right yeah

1068
00:41:52,390 --> 00:41:50,869
and the gasoline is burnt in the engine

1069
00:41:56,079 --> 00:41:52,400
and it pushes the cylinders around

1070
00:41:57,940 --> 00:41:56,089
mm-hmm now the way it it pushes the

1071
00:41:59,710 --> 00:41:57,950
cylinders no which rotates the the

1072
00:42:01,210 --> 00:41:59,720
crankshaft which rotates the the real

1073
00:42:04,089 --> 00:42:01,220
the wheel which rotates the in the main

1074
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:04,099
axle is the basically used tiny little

1075
00:42:11,650 --> 00:42:06,890
explosions and they only use a really

1076
00:42:16,210 --> 00:42:11,660
really small amount of gasoline at once

1077
00:42:19,980 --> 00:42:16,220
like each time the engine good each one

1078
00:42:23,740 --> 00:42:19,990
of those little pops in a car engine is

1079
00:42:25,900 --> 00:42:23,750
essentially an explosion and you know a

1080
00:42:30,249 --> 00:42:25,910
car engine can last a really really long

1081
00:42:32,289 --> 00:42:30,259
time on just one one gallon of gasoline

1082
00:42:35,099 --> 00:42:32,299
yeah you could actually sit an idle your

1083
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:35,109
engine for like you know probably like

1084
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:38,930
several hours on on one gallon how

1085
00:42:45,190 --> 00:42:41,410
efficient you are and it's actually

1086
00:42:46,240 --> 00:42:45,200
explosions going off constantly now if

1087
00:42:48,610 --> 00:42:46,250
you were to make essentially

1088
00:42:51,370 --> 00:42:48,620
like a really really big car cylinder

1089
00:42:53,610 --> 00:42:51,380
and get the gasoline into this this car

1090
00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:53,620
cylinder in a way that it was kind of

1091
00:42:59,680 --> 00:42:56,330
kept atomized in the same way it is like

1092
00:43:04,030 --> 00:42:59,690
when he sprayed in into a car cylinder

1093
00:43:06,070 --> 00:43:04,040
engine you could think of the the lift

1094
00:43:11,050 --> 00:43:06,080
shaft of the World Trade Center as being

1095
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:11,060
like that that car cylinder and when

1096
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:14,210
this jet fuel which is essentially very

1097
00:43:20,110 --> 00:43:17,090
similar to gasoline gets at the bottom

1098
00:43:24,100 --> 00:43:20,120
of this this cylinder the the lift shaft

1099
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:24,110
and then gets ignited you've got an

1100
00:43:28,030 --> 00:43:26,090
explosion like a car cylinder except a

1101
00:43:29,830 --> 00:43:28,040
much bigger one instead of it being like

1102
00:43:34,510 --> 00:43:29,840
you know two five cubic inches or

1103
00:43:36,370 --> 00:43:34,520
something it's just a is this this huge

1104
00:43:38,740 --> 00:43:36,380
you know several cubic feet you know

1105
00:43:40,900 --> 00:43:38,750
hundreds of cubic feet so you get this

1106
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:40,910
there's this very very large explosion

1107
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:42,890
from a relatively small amount of

1108
00:43:47,470 --> 00:43:45,770
gasoline and I don't know if that sounds

1109
00:43:50,410 --> 00:43:47,480
does that sound like a bit of hand

1110
00:43:52,660 --> 00:43:50,420
waving to you or does it make any sense

1111
00:43:54,010 --> 00:43:52,670
there's mother that's hand waving it's a

1112
00:43:59,320 --> 00:43:54,020
little bit over my head

1113
00:44:03,070 --> 00:43:59,330
all right the other hood of a flower

1114
00:44:05,370 --> 00:44:03,080
explosion or what a flower explosion

1115
00:44:08,020 --> 00:44:05,380
like the flower that you make bread with

1116
00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:08,030
no no this is something relevant

1117
00:44:14,830 --> 00:44:11,930
sometimes in in Mills if the flower gets

1118
00:44:16,420 --> 00:44:14,840
in the air and it's just kind of

1119
00:44:18,310 --> 00:44:16,430
suspended in the air like all this dust

1120
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:18,320
if there's a spark it can actually

1121
00:44:25,690 --> 00:44:21,290
explode and sometimes you you get these

1122
00:44:29,350 --> 00:44:25,700
flour mills exploding just from flour in

1123
00:44:32,710 --> 00:44:29,360
the air it's if you get a substance that

1124
00:44:34,030 --> 00:44:32,720
burns and you you have an atomized yes

1125
00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:34,040
so it's kind of like a spray like an

1126
00:44:38,890 --> 00:44:36,530
aerosol spray in the air and then you

1127
00:44:41,380 --> 00:44:38,900
ignite it it burns very very rapidly

1128
00:44:44,710 --> 00:44:41,390
essentially it explodes explosion is

1129
00:44:47,380 --> 00:44:44,720
just rapid confused combustion so it

1130
00:44:51,970 --> 00:44:47,390
doesn't actually take very much jet fuel

1131
00:44:53,740 --> 00:44:51,980
to create a large explosion especially

1132
00:44:58,000 --> 00:44:53,750
if it's been atomized by say falling

1133
00:44:59,530 --> 00:44:58,010
down a lift shaft and the explosion

1134
00:45:01,120 --> 00:44:59,540
itself actually further atomizers

1135
00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:01,130
or stuff around it and that's why you

1136
00:45:06,130 --> 00:45:03,890
get this big fireball explosions and you

1137
00:45:08,530 --> 00:45:06,140
don't actually need that much I think a

1138
00:45:10,690 --> 00:45:08,540
gallon of jet fuel

1139
00:45:13,300 --> 00:45:10,700
I looked it up for a while ago but I

1140
00:45:14,740 --> 00:45:13,310
can't fight it right now is the

1141
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:14,750
equivalent to something like five sticks

1142
00:45:19,990 --> 00:45:18,410
of dynamite and you know how much damage

1143
00:45:22,930 --> 00:45:20,000
you can do with like a few sticks of

1144
00:45:26,290 --> 00:45:22,940
dynamite so even if something as small

1145
00:45:29,890 --> 00:45:26,300
say 10 gallons of jet fuel made it to

1146
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:29,900
the bottom of that that shaft it could

1147
00:45:37,480 --> 00:45:34,010
do an explosion equivalent to say fifty

1148
00:45:40,320 --> 00:45:37,490
sticks of dynamite like a big crate of

1149
00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:40,330
dynamite essentially which I think

1150
00:45:45,490 --> 00:45:43,490
you've seen enough movies to know that a

1151
00:45:48,070 --> 00:45:45,500
crater dynamite is enough to do quite a

1152
00:45:51,700 --> 00:45:48,080
lot of damage hey Mick if you have any

1153
00:45:53,260 --> 00:45:51,710
um sources or calculations on there send

1154
00:45:55,450 --> 00:45:53,270
them to me please I'd like to review it

1155
00:45:57,910 --> 00:45:55,460
yes I just looked up and the source is

1156
00:45:59,530 --> 00:45:57,920
actually a single it says here a single

1157
00:46:04,060 --> 00:45:59,540
gallon of gasoline has the explosive

1158
00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:04,070
energy of 83 sticks of dynamite Wow

1159
00:46:10,840 --> 00:46:07,490
this is uh this is actually from an

1160
00:46:12,670 --> 00:46:10,850
article for farmers like saying they

1161
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:12,680
have to be careful about empty

1162
00:46:18,330 --> 00:46:15,770
containers it's actually got gasoline in

1163
00:46:21,850 --> 00:46:18,340
it still here like in the vapor form a

1164
00:46:24,660 --> 00:46:21,860
250 gallon fuel tank there has one

1165
00:46:28,060 --> 00:46:24,670
gallon of residual gasoline in it

1166
00:46:29,950 --> 00:46:28,070
can come if it vaporizes and then

1167
00:46:31,810 --> 00:46:29,960
ignites in that situation it's the

1168
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:31,820
explosive energy of 83 sticks of

1169
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:33,770
dynamite I will send you the link to

1170
00:46:37,780 --> 00:46:35,450
that spread it's the Purdue News and the

1171
00:46:39,910 --> 00:46:37,790
article is titled farmers should use

1172
00:46:42,580 --> 00:46:39,920
extra caution with gasoline so that's

1173
00:46:43,570 --> 00:46:42,590
just one one gallon I thought it was far

1174
00:46:46,270 --> 00:46:43,580
less than that I'm quite surprised

1175
00:46:48,190 --> 00:46:46,280
socially eighty-three sticks of dynamite

1176
00:46:52,300 --> 00:46:48,200
thank you for your information

1177
00:46:55,840 --> 00:46:52,310
um this is what Rodriguez said this is

1178
00:46:57,940 --> 00:46:55,850
curious to me he said I remember the

1179
00:47:00,310 --> 00:46:57,950
exact words at the beginning of the

1180
00:47:02,650 --> 00:47:00,320
quote but he said it was you know going

1181
00:47:05,140 --> 00:47:02,660
about his business that day when he

1182
00:47:07,930 --> 00:47:05,150
heard it was an explosion so hard that

1183
00:47:10,780 --> 00:47:07,940
it pushed him upwards it came from the

1184
00:47:13,029 --> 00:47:10,790
b2 level or the b3 level and he thought

1185
00:47:14,769 --> 00:47:13,039
that a generator had exploded

1186
00:47:17,199 --> 00:47:14,779
mm-hmm and when he went to verbalize

1187
00:47:19,599 --> 00:47:17,209
that thought he heard boom the impact of

1188
00:47:21,309 --> 00:47:19,609
a plane on the top and he said now 20

1189
00:47:23,079 --> 00:47:21,319
years working in the building you know

1190
00:47:24,969 --> 00:47:23,089
the difference between these two

1191
00:47:27,219 --> 00:47:24,979
different events one explosions on the

1192
00:47:30,969 --> 00:47:27,229
bottom first that pushed me upwards and

1193
00:47:33,489 --> 00:47:30,979
then playing on the top yeah yeah I

1194
00:47:36,130 --> 00:47:33,499
think there's a number of things you can

1195
00:47:38,589 --> 00:47:36,140
talk about there like when did he first

1196
00:47:40,479 --> 00:47:38,599
tell that story I don't know yeah I mean

1197
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:40,489
if he told it even like six months

1198
00:47:45,640 --> 00:47:42,650
afterwards is he remembering it

1199
00:47:48,159 --> 00:47:45,650
correctly like you know like when things

1200
00:47:51,009 --> 00:47:48,169
happen you can very easily confuse the

1201
00:47:54,159 --> 00:47:51,019
order in which things happened as you

1202
00:47:57,519 --> 00:47:54,169
get old if you I'm talking about myself

1203
00:47:59,409 --> 00:47:57,529
here and not him you recognize that your

1204
00:48:03,669 --> 00:47:59,419
memory isn't perfect so it could be that

1205
00:48:05,759 --> 00:48:03,679
on the day he experienced explosions and

1206
00:48:07,809 --> 00:48:05,769
noises and things like that and

1207
00:48:09,759 --> 00:48:07,819
obviously he was an extraordinary

1208
00:48:11,499 --> 00:48:09,769
stressful situation and he didn't stop

1209
00:48:14,079 --> 00:48:11,509
to think why wonder why it happened in

1210
00:48:16,359 --> 00:48:14,089
that auto cuz he he had no idea what was

1211
00:48:17,709 --> 00:48:16,369
actually happening he didn't he didn't

1212
00:48:19,539 --> 00:48:17,719
like think oh that's the plane hitting

1213
00:48:22,089 --> 00:48:19,549
the building because he didn't know a

1214
00:48:24,159 --> 00:48:22,099
plane was hitting the building so how is

1215
00:48:26,380 --> 00:48:24,169
he knowing what order things actually

1216
00:48:28,749 --> 00:48:26,390
happened and if he doesn't know what's

1217
00:48:30,659 --> 00:48:28,759
actually going on I think basically what

1218
00:48:33,009 --> 00:48:30,669
you got there is someone who just

1219
00:48:35,859 --> 00:48:33,019
doesn't remember the exact order of

1220
00:48:37,419 --> 00:48:35,869
things happening and then later thinks

1221
00:48:39,189 --> 00:48:37,429
he remembered that and he became

1222
00:48:41,890 --> 00:48:39,199
convinced that that's what happened I

1223
00:48:44,529 --> 00:48:41,900
actually interviewed a couple of weeks

1224
00:48:47,529 --> 00:48:44,539
ago one of the world's leading experts

1225
00:48:50,529 --> 00:48:47,539
on false memories and a Miss Elizabeth

1226
00:48:53,079 --> 00:48:50,539
Loftus you know that name have two

1227
00:48:54,969 --> 00:48:53,089
degrees in psychology so I think came up

1228
00:48:56,049 --> 00:48:54,979
at some point of my study yeah and as

1229
00:48:57,519 --> 00:48:56,059
she probably would because she's been

1230
00:48:59,289 --> 00:48:57,529
there she's been studying this type of

1231
00:49:02,079 --> 00:48:59,299
thing for a long time and she's

1232
00:49:05,349 --> 00:49:02,089
basically demonstrates just how easy it

1233
00:49:06,279 --> 00:49:05,359
is for people to form false memories you

1234
00:49:08,169 --> 00:49:06,289
know people can have false memories

1235
00:49:12,009 --> 00:49:08,179
implanted deliberately but they can also

1236
00:49:14,649 --> 00:49:12,019
just form on their own and and it's not

1237
00:49:16,359 --> 00:49:14,659
just almost like not a false memory like

1238
00:49:18,189 --> 00:49:16,369
not remembering what order something

1239
00:49:21,399 --> 00:49:18,199
happened in like did I do this before I

1240
00:49:23,979 --> 00:49:21,409
did this you know you go on a vacation

1241
00:49:26,289 --> 00:49:23,989
you can't remember like did I go to this

1242
00:49:26,920 --> 00:49:26,299
this spot before I went to that spot you

1243
00:49:28,510 --> 00:49:26,930
know

1244
00:49:30,339 --> 00:49:28,520
remember which order you did things and

1245
00:49:32,920 --> 00:49:30,349
yeah you know even even personally I

1246
00:49:35,589 --> 00:49:32,930
have memories of my that I from my own

1247
00:49:37,990 --> 00:49:35,599
past that I know are wrong right yeah

1248
00:49:39,910 --> 00:49:38,000
because I like I remember doing this and

1249
00:49:42,670 --> 00:49:39,920
then doing this and then when I look at

1250
00:49:44,079 --> 00:49:42,680
the actual facts for the circumstances

1251
00:49:45,280 --> 00:49:44,089
well I didn't even know that person at

1252
00:49:47,319 --> 00:49:45,290
that time so it couldn't have been you

1253
00:49:49,870 --> 00:49:47,329
know I mean yeah yeah I sometimes catch

1254
00:49:51,670 --> 00:49:49,880
myself almost like falling into these

1255
00:49:53,260 --> 00:49:51,680
false memories like I think oh yeah I

1256
00:49:56,710 --> 00:49:53,270
can I know I know that didn't actually

1257
00:49:58,809 --> 00:49:56,720
happen so yeah things you could would

1258
00:50:01,059 --> 00:49:58,819
but once she starts if you don't catch

1259
00:50:02,349 --> 00:50:01,069
yourself or if you don't have some way

1260
00:50:04,599 --> 00:50:02,359
of verifying you know what actually

1261
00:50:07,240 --> 00:50:04,609
happened then yeah you get stuck with

1262
00:50:09,250 --> 00:50:07,250
this false memory and I think you know

1263
00:50:12,280 --> 00:50:09,260
that's probably what happened to this

1264
00:50:15,970 --> 00:50:12,290
guy maybe it could be it could be like

1265
00:50:17,349 --> 00:50:15,980
another alternative is that he didn't

1266
00:50:23,109 --> 00:50:17,359
actually hear the plane hit the building

1267
00:50:24,849 --> 00:50:23,119
and that what he heard first was the

1268
00:50:25,870 --> 00:50:24,859
explosion you know the fuel went down

1269
00:50:28,270 --> 00:50:25,880
and the second thing he heard was

1270
00:50:29,620 --> 00:50:28,280
something like an elevated car falling

1271
00:50:31,420 --> 00:50:29,630
from the top of the building and

1272
00:50:33,630 --> 00:50:31,430
impacting the bottom of the building I

1273
00:50:36,099 --> 00:50:33,640
was talking about Larry Silverstein

1274
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:36,109
Larry Silverstein acquired the World

1275
00:50:40,270 --> 00:50:38,450
Trade Center he already owned building

1276
00:50:42,930 --> 00:50:40,280
seven but he acquired the towers I think

1277
00:50:45,220 --> 00:50:42,940
something like six weeks before 9/11 and

1278
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:45,230
you know a lot is made about this

1279
00:50:52,240 --> 00:50:47,690
insurance policy that he took out to my

1280
00:50:54,630 --> 00:50:52,250
mind you know the World Trade Center was

1281
00:50:56,799 --> 00:50:54,640
attacked in 1993 so it's not completely

1282
00:50:59,620 --> 00:50:56,809
implausible that somebody would take out

1283
00:51:02,349 --> 00:50:59,630
an insurance policy regarding terrorism

1284
00:51:04,750 --> 00:51:02,359
being that the building was already

1285
00:51:06,609 --> 00:51:04,760
attacked once before what puzzles me

1286
00:51:07,839 --> 00:51:06,619
about that is not so much the insurance

1287
00:51:10,359 --> 00:51:07,849
policy by itself

1288
00:51:11,799 --> 00:51:10,369
why did you even acquired the towers to

1289
00:51:14,020 --> 00:51:11,809
begin with for any reason I mean they

1290
00:51:16,180 --> 00:51:14,030
were they were a disaster there were

1291
00:51:18,039 --> 00:51:16,190
more of a liability than they were a

1292
00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:18,049
commodity at that point with all the

1293
00:51:25,289 --> 00:51:21,290
asbestos and in there like I'm not a

1294
00:51:27,970 --> 00:51:25,299
real estate expert that's Donald Trump

1295
00:51:29,799 --> 00:51:27,980
he was a New York billionaire to talk to

1296
00:51:33,370 --> 00:51:29,809
Donald Trump no thank you

1297
00:51:36,400 --> 00:51:33,380
I think he acquired them because he

1298
00:51:40,359 --> 00:51:36,410
thought he could make money so obviously

1299
00:51:43,930 --> 00:51:40,369
he there was some path to making my

1300
00:51:46,839 --> 00:51:43,940
he he had seen he had this his

1301
00:51:48,099 --> 00:51:46,849
accountants had calculated would happen

1302
00:51:51,609 --> 00:51:48,109
like he probably got them for a

1303
00:51:54,009 --> 00:51:51,619
reasonably cheap price they they were

1304
00:51:56,890 --> 00:51:54,019
being rented out so there was like you

1305
00:51:59,289 --> 00:51:56,900
know just this lot miss income from them

1306
00:52:01,120 --> 00:51:59,299
and they did have retaining wall value

1307
00:52:03,970 --> 00:52:01,130
so they could be resold in the future

1308
00:52:05,769 --> 00:52:03,980
and they did have like obviously they

1309
00:52:08,170 --> 00:52:05,779
had problems with asbestos and stuff

1310
00:52:11,319 --> 00:52:08,180
like that but that was being remediated

1311
00:52:14,140 --> 00:52:11,329
I mean I don't know exactly what the the

1312
00:52:16,950 --> 00:52:14,150
numbers are they put the cost but the of

1313
00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:16,960
the removal of doing the house who did I

1314
00:52:23,829 --> 00:52:21,650
picked the Port Authority yeah so I mean

1315
00:52:25,809 --> 00:52:23,839
how will how much would the World Trade

1316
00:52:29,079 --> 00:52:25,819
Center be worth now if it was still

1317
00:52:33,759 --> 00:52:29,089
standing and had all the healthiest

1318
00:52:35,589 --> 00:52:33,769
asbestos removed hmm I don't know I mean

1319
00:52:39,299 --> 00:52:35,599
it probably is quite a valuable building

1320
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:39,309
really they will trace into one now is

1321
00:52:45,370 --> 00:52:42,170
probably costs worth well over a billion

1322
00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:45,380
dollars so I think yeah when when you

1323
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:49,249
buy a building you're looking at the 30

1324
00:52:54,460 --> 00:52:51,650
to 50 year timeline of making money from

1325
00:52:55,390 --> 00:52:54,470
it you know buying a building just

1326
00:52:57,999 --> 00:52:55,400
thinking that you know it's going to

1327
00:53:00,549 --> 00:52:58,009
increase in value either it's part of

1328
00:53:01,839 --> 00:53:00,559
some great satanic plot or his

1329
00:53:03,029 --> 00:53:01,849
accountants figure out some way of

1330
00:53:09,190 --> 00:53:03,039
making money from it

1331
00:53:10,539 --> 00:53:09,200
ASA's England I guess yeah as I didn't

1332
00:53:13,930 --> 00:53:10,549
mean to say satanic they're just you

1333
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:13,940
just blocked out it was just some I know

1334
00:53:21,099 --> 00:53:18,650
no evil plot let's say that but yes sir

1335
00:53:22,779 --> 00:53:21,109
I think I don't think okay I had a guy I

1336
00:53:25,210 --> 00:53:22,789
had a guy in the 9/11 truth movement

1337
00:53:29,039 --> 00:53:25,220
recently trying to convince me that 9/11

1338
00:53:33,700 --> 00:53:29,049
was a satanic cult operation and that

1339
00:53:38,950 --> 00:53:33,710
the numbers of all the flight numbers

1340
00:53:41,140 --> 00:53:38,960
and everything or a satanic code like I

1341
00:53:44,109 --> 00:53:41,150
mean that's not typical obviously most

1342
00:53:47,499 --> 00:53:44,119
people are not like that but he get a

1343
00:53:49,960 --> 00:53:47,509
few people because you know he say the

1344
00:53:53,890 --> 00:53:49,970
the movements kind of being I don't know

1345
00:53:55,420 --> 00:53:53,900
kind of dying off to a degree and so

1346
00:53:56,920 --> 00:53:55,430
I wonder if that kind of like makes it

1347
00:54:00,310 --> 00:53:56,930
filter down a little bit more to the

1348
00:54:03,010 --> 00:54:00,320
more hardline people that the no more

1349
00:54:05,380 --> 00:54:03,020
eccentric people are yeah one of my

1350
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:05,390
theories is that certain people are just

1351
00:54:08,710 --> 00:54:07,370
so desperate to have people in the

1352
00:54:10,360 --> 00:54:08,720
movement that agree with them that they

1353
00:54:13,680 --> 00:54:10,370
open their arms to anybody no matter how

1354
00:54:16,540 --> 00:54:13,690
wacky their theories are and my theory

1355
00:54:20,100 --> 00:54:16,550
hey I wanted to ask you something

1356
00:54:22,780 --> 00:54:20,110
I saw in the 9/11 truth action projects

1357
00:54:28,240 --> 00:54:22,790
websites they have this section called

1358
00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:28,250
dr. T Ruth's mental health and 9/11 and

1359
00:54:33,940 --> 00:54:30,410
it's got a bunch of kind of interesting

1360
00:54:35,410 --> 00:54:33,950
articles there's an article I think dr.

1361
00:54:37,720 --> 00:54:35,420
T Ruth or misinformation and

1362
00:54:39,250 --> 00:54:37,730
disinformation and it's it's actually

1363
00:54:41,650 --> 00:54:39,260
kind of an interesting article because

1364
00:54:43,630 --> 00:54:41,660
it's it's talking about how you need to

1365
00:54:45,340 --> 00:54:43,640
have respect for other people and you

1366
00:54:48,610 --> 00:54:45,350
need to be polite

1367
00:54:50,050 --> 00:54:48,620
when discussing topics with them and you

1368
00:54:51,670 --> 00:54:50,060
know you don't want to get angry and

1369
00:54:55,180 --> 00:54:51,680
start shouting at them and accusing them

1370
00:54:58,090 --> 00:54:55,190
of being being shills actually thought

1371
00:55:01,630 --> 00:54:58,100
it was like a pretty good article in the

1372
00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:01,640
general the general gist of it because

1373
00:55:06,180 --> 00:55:03,530
it's kind of like what I say I tell

1374
00:55:08,200 --> 00:55:06,190
people that you need to be respectful of

1375
00:55:10,030 --> 00:55:08,210
people when you're talking to them and

1376
00:55:11,970 --> 00:55:10,040
you don't want to get angry and that you

1377
00:55:15,250 --> 00:55:11,980
you could it be you know open-minded you

1378
00:55:16,600 --> 00:55:15,260
know one of you can wonder yeah yeah

1379
00:55:19,660 --> 00:55:16,610
like you want to have a genuine

1380
00:55:21,580 --> 00:55:19,670
discussion with them it's interesting it

1381
00:55:24,970 --> 00:55:21,590
is this guy who wrote it was his name

1382
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:24,980
doctor I see a doctor Christopher Gruner

1383
00:55:29,430 --> 00:55:27,050
do you know do you know this person no I

1384
00:55:32,560 --> 00:55:29,440
don't this is a mental health counselor

1385
00:55:34,390 --> 00:55:32,570
what if I've not I've not explored that

1386
00:55:37,450 --> 00:55:34,400
section of the website to be honest

1387
00:55:39,240 --> 00:55:37,460
yeah probably well yeah it was

1388
00:55:43,660 --> 00:55:39,250
interesting because it was a fairly

1389
00:55:48,580 --> 00:55:43,670
prominent part of the website like if he

1390
00:55:50,260 --> 00:55:48,590
goes in 911 tap org on the the top

1391
00:55:54,220 --> 00:55:50,270
there's like a little menu and it says

1392
00:55:56,830 --> 00:55:54,230
like about as media contact us and then

1393
00:55:58,240 --> 00:55:56,840
dr. T Ruth so there's like he has six

1394
00:56:01,270 --> 00:55:58,250
things on the top and that's like right

1395
00:56:03,190 --> 00:56:01,280
there in the middle of it and the first

1396
00:56:04,720 --> 00:56:03,200
thing I see actually I'm not even

1397
00:56:07,630 --> 00:56:04,730
looking at that page but the first thing

1398
00:56:10,150 --> 00:56:07,640
I don't know Ivan truth homepages

1399
00:56:14,470 --> 00:56:10,160
ecological warfare it seems like there's

1400
00:56:16,960 --> 00:56:14,480
a lot of focus on psychology do you get

1401
00:56:19,330 --> 00:56:16,970
that that sense that people talk about

1402
00:56:22,120 --> 00:56:19,340
that RDA do you think it's still more

1403
00:56:23,860 --> 00:56:22,130
about the physics than than that I think

1404
00:56:26,070 --> 00:56:23,870
it's still more about the physical I

1405
00:56:28,630 --> 00:56:26,080
don't come across too much talk about

1406
00:56:31,330 --> 00:56:28,640
mental health and psychology and in my

1407
00:56:34,390 --> 00:56:31,340
travels anyway yeah

1408
00:56:37,080 --> 00:56:34,400
Essaouira I guess a YouTube video a

1409
00:56:40,930 --> 00:56:37,090
while back and it was basically

1410
00:56:43,960 --> 00:56:40,940
diagnosing debunkers like myself as

1411
00:56:48,250 --> 00:56:43,970
being mentally ill because we're unable

1412
00:56:50,830 --> 00:56:48,260
to open our eyes to the reality of 911

1413
00:56:54,880 --> 00:56:50,840
to be fair we've been painted by with

1414
00:56:56,020 --> 00:56:54,890
that brush for years yeah but do you

1415
00:57:00,490 --> 00:56:56,030
actually think it's true in the other

1416
00:57:02,050 --> 00:57:00,500
direction well as a mental health

1417
00:57:04,980 --> 00:57:02,060
professional or a former mental health

1418
00:57:08,550 --> 00:57:04,990
professional and as a person who has

1419
00:57:11,110 --> 00:57:08,560
myselfi schizophrenia spectrum disorder

1420
00:57:13,360 --> 00:57:11,120
there's definitely mental illness from

1421
00:57:16,060 --> 00:57:13,370
both sides and you know if you look for

1422
00:57:18,430 --> 00:57:16,070
it you'll find it I mean I I try not to

1423
00:57:20,710 --> 00:57:18,440
diagnose people in my head but yeah yeah

1424
00:57:21,850 --> 00:57:20,720
I've certainly come across plenty of

1425
00:57:25,600 --> 00:57:21,860
people in the movement that I'm like

1426
00:57:29,710 --> 00:57:25,610
good boy yeah we come across people in

1427
00:57:31,840 --> 00:57:29,720
normal life who do you think that but I

1428
00:57:33,820 --> 00:57:31,850
guess they stand out more like I

1429
00:57:35,710 --> 00:57:33,830
remember going to a chemtrails

1430
00:57:37,600 --> 00:57:35,720
conference a few years ago and you most

1431
00:57:40,120 --> 00:57:37,610
people they're just like you know nice

1432
00:57:42,070 --> 00:57:40,130
normal people who happen to believe in

1433
00:57:44,830 --> 00:57:42,080
chemtrails but there's also a few kind

1434
00:57:47,470 --> 00:57:44,840
of kooky people there as well so I think

1435
00:57:49,300 --> 00:57:47,480
you know in any if you go to a football

1436
00:57:52,600 --> 00:57:49,310
game you're gonna see some crazy people

1437
00:57:54,190 --> 00:57:52,610
yeah yeah yeah I don't like the idea

1438
00:57:56,290 --> 00:57:54,200
that some people have like of saying

1439
00:57:58,090 --> 00:57:56,300
that just cause someone's a 9/11 truther

1440
00:58:00,370 --> 00:57:58,100
that means they're a crazy person or

1441
00:58:01,210 --> 00:58:00,380
other insane demented mentally ill or

1442
00:58:03,670 --> 00:58:01,220
something I think

1443
00:58:06,130 --> 00:58:03,680
yeah the verity of people are just

1444
00:58:08,890 --> 00:58:06,140
regular people who in my mind are just

1445
00:58:10,660 --> 00:58:08,900
mistaken in their beliefs I would agree

1446
00:58:13,810 --> 00:58:10,670
with that I would agree with that in

1447
00:58:15,700 --> 00:58:13,820
both directions I don't I don't think

1448
00:58:17,500 --> 00:58:15,710
I'm crazy I know I have a diagnosis but

1449
00:58:18,910 --> 00:58:17,510
I take my medication I do very well and

1450
00:58:20,020 --> 00:58:18,920
don't have any symptoms really at this

1451
00:58:22,660 --> 00:58:20,030
point and

1452
00:58:26,620 --> 00:58:22,670
seemed crazy the Popular Mechanics might

1453
00:58:29,740 --> 00:58:26,630
have a different take on it well what do

1454
00:58:33,520 --> 00:58:29,750
you actually believe about 9/11 that you

1455
00:58:34,710 --> 00:58:33,530
think other people might think is that a

1456
00:58:37,360 --> 00:58:34,720
delusional huh

1457
00:58:38,500 --> 00:58:37,370
do you have any experience what's the

1458
00:58:41,140 --> 00:58:38,510
most extreme thing you actually

1459
00:58:43,930 --> 00:58:41,150
personally believe rather than just

1460
00:58:46,090 --> 00:58:43,940
simply having questions about it hmm

1461
00:58:48,490 --> 00:58:46,100
I mean controlled demolition is as far

1462
00:58:49,720 --> 00:58:48,500
down the rabbit hole as I go do you

1463
00:58:52,630 --> 00:58:49,730
think there was a controlled demolition

1464
00:58:54,100 --> 00:58:52,640
I think there's a chance whether it was

1465
00:58:57,640 --> 00:58:54,110
a controlled demolition a good chance

1466
00:58:59,910 --> 00:58:57,650
like if you were to put your probability

1467
00:59:02,290 --> 00:58:59,920
on a scale of say zero to a hundred

1468
00:59:03,910 --> 00:59:02,300
where a hundred is you're completely

1469
00:59:06,370 --> 00:59:03,920
sure there was controlled demolition

1470
00:59:08,140 --> 00:59:06,380
where would you say you are at it could

1471
00:59:11,020 --> 00:59:08,150
be honest with you Mick it changes all

1472
00:59:14,050 --> 00:59:11,030
the time hmm and what happens with me is

1473
00:59:15,970 --> 00:59:14,060
I I try to expose myself to as much

1474
00:59:17,410 --> 00:59:15,980
information as I can on both sides of

1475
00:59:19,060 --> 00:59:17,420
the debate and I end up kind of

1476
00:59:20,560 --> 00:59:19,070
flip-flopping I see something or hear

1477
00:59:22,390 --> 00:59:20,570
something or read something and go

1478
00:59:24,070 --> 00:59:22,400
that's it it was a controlled demolition

1479
00:59:25,780 --> 00:59:24,080
for sure and then I see something else

1480
00:59:28,360 --> 00:59:25,790
on the other side and go wait no it

1481
00:59:32,890 --> 00:59:28,370
wasn't you know you can drive yourself a

1482
00:59:36,370 --> 00:59:32,900
little nuts so do you feel like you're

1483
00:59:39,160 --> 00:59:36,380
you're less believing like and they're

1484
00:59:42,640 --> 00:59:39,170
like 2% less or something after talking

1485
00:59:44,860 --> 00:59:42,650
to me or is it not change you at all um

1486
00:59:46,720 --> 00:59:44,870
yeah I mean some of the responses you

1487
00:59:50,680 --> 00:59:46,730
had to some of the questions I raised

1488
00:59:52,300 --> 00:59:50,690
were pretty found and reasonable I don't

1489
00:59:54,580 --> 00:59:52,310
know if I agree with everything you said

1490
00:59:56,290 --> 00:59:54,590
but no I wouldn't expect you to like

1491
00:59:58,090 --> 00:59:56,300
yeah you can't you can't just have like

1492
00:59:59,920 --> 00:59:58,100
oh you know one our discussion and then

1493
01:00:03,310 --> 00:59:59,930
have someone changed their minds that's

1494
01:00:06,520 --> 01:00:03,320
not gonna gonna work but yeah if you can

1495
01:00:09,130 --> 01:00:06,530
even talk about these things and yes a

1496
01:00:11,890 --> 01:00:09,140
lot of these is kind of interpretation

1497
01:00:15,490 --> 01:00:11,900
of things though like yeah that that guy

1498
01:00:17,760 --> 01:00:15,500
who yeah remembered an explosion before

1499
01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:17,770
he thinks the plane hit the building

1500
01:00:21,910 --> 01:00:20,090
yeah that's that's not something it's

1501
01:00:24,820 --> 01:00:21,920
not something it's be intangible in a

1502
01:00:27,580 --> 01:00:24,830
way you can't really get yeah yeah yeah

1503
01:00:30,160 --> 01:00:27,590
it sees it what if eyewitness testimony

1504
01:00:31,990 --> 01:00:30,170
in level it's not the best evidence you

1505
01:00:33,310 --> 01:00:32,000
know that yeah but I don't want to

1506
01:00:33,580 --> 01:00:33,320
discount the completely like I said I

1507
01:00:35,710 --> 01:00:33,590
would

1508
01:00:38,470 --> 01:00:35,720
Simoni it isn't admissible in a court of

1509
01:00:39,940 --> 01:00:38,480
law so this some kind of credibility

1510
01:00:43,390 --> 01:00:39,950
that eyewitness testimony

1511
01:00:45,010 --> 01:00:43,400
yeah actually elizabeth loftis one of

1512
01:00:48,340 --> 01:00:45,020
the things she talks about a lot is she

1513
01:00:51,100 --> 01:00:48,350
she actually goes to trials as usually a

1514
01:00:54,250 --> 01:00:51,110
an expert witness for the defense to

1515
01:00:57,510 --> 01:00:54,260
explain how I win this testimony isn't

1516
01:01:01,090 --> 01:00:57,520
as reliable as people think it is and

1517
01:01:05,110 --> 01:01:01,100
often people actually gets get released

1518
01:01:07,660 --> 01:01:05,120
and get found not guilty because of

1519
01:01:09,970 --> 01:01:07,670
their testimony because the the trial is

1520
01:01:13,540 --> 01:01:09,980
based that the accusation is based upon

1521
01:01:16,180 --> 01:01:13,550
eyewitness testimony only and it's

1522
01:01:18,160 --> 01:01:16,190
something like you know this one person

1523
01:01:21,400 --> 01:01:18,170
picks somebody out of a lineup and says

1524
01:01:23,110 --> 01:01:21,410
that's the guy and that's all the

1525
01:01:24,640 --> 01:01:23,120
evidence they have and so she goes into

1526
01:01:27,520 --> 01:01:24,650
the course and it says it's very easy to

1527
01:01:29,080 --> 01:01:27,530
for these memories to be false or also

1528
01:01:31,210 --> 01:01:29,090
one will say I remember this happening

1529
01:01:33,280 --> 01:01:31,220
and someone else says they remember

1530
01:01:34,600 --> 01:01:33,290
something else happening and then you

1531
01:01:36,520 --> 01:01:34,610
know she has to explain to the judge

1532
01:01:39,490 --> 01:01:36,530
there's no way of knowing which one of

1533
01:01:42,970 --> 01:01:39,500
these things is correct and both these

1534
01:01:45,790 --> 01:01:42,980
people could genuinely be remembering it

1535
01:01:47,080 --> 01:01:45,800
honestly but incorrectly because the

1536
01:01:49,150 --> 01:01:47,090
judge is thinking one of these people is

1537
01:01:51,970 --> 01:01:49,160
lying but actually it should both of

1538
01:01:54,820 --> 01:01:51,980
them have bad memories right and yes

1539
01:01:57,550 --> 01:01:54,830
some eyewitness testimony is memory is

1540
01:01:59,440 --> 01:01:57,560
people like bringing their memory to a

1541
01:02:01,630 --> 01:01:59,450
court and saying this is what I remember

1542
01:02:04,180 --> 01:02:01,640
and they're just just because he's had

1543
01:02:06,700 --> 01:02:04,190
missable doesn't mean it's actually any

1544
01:02:08,980 --> 01:02:06,710
good that's true that's true

1545
01:02:11,290 --> 01:02:08,990
I have something to say I have something

1546
01:02:13,900 --> 01:02:11,300
to say about NIST too sure go ahead

1547
01:02:17,530 --> 01:02:13,910
a lot of people think that the NIST

1548
01:02:20,500 --> 01:02:17,540
report is is bogus I have certainly felt

1549
01:02:24,460 --> 01:02:20,510
that way at times myself but I do not

1550
01:02:26,830 --> 01:02:24,470
think I do not think that somebody from

1551
01:02:28,990 --> 01:02:26,840
the government came and took Shyam

1552
01:02:30,580 --> 01:02:29,000
sunder and John gross

1553
01:02:31,930 --> 01:02:30,590
pull them aside said listen we blew up

1554
01:02:33,760 --> 01:02:31,940
the World Trade Center we need you to

1555
01:02:36,190 --> 01:02:33,770
cover it up I don't think that's what

1556
01:02:37,960 --> 01:02:36,200
happened I think when you work for any

1557
01:02:40,060 --> 01:02:37,970
kind of agency and you do any of this

1558
01:02:42,610 --> 01:02:40,070
kind of work it goes without saying that

1559
01:02:44,650 --> 01:02:42,620
you're not going to implicate your your

1560
01:02:46,400 --> 01:02:44,660
government or your agency or your people

1561
01:02:48,829 --> 01:02:46,410
that you work for and anything wrong and

1562
01:02:50,569 --> 01:02:48,839
kind of wrongdoing ever you know I'm

1563
01:02:52,970 --> 01:02:50,579
saying and I'm not saying necessarily

1564
01:02:54,230 --> 01:02:52,980
that these guys said oh it's a

1565
01:02:55,940 --> 01:02:54,240
controlled demolition but we better hush

1566
01:02:56,210 --> 01:02:55,950
it up I just think you don't even go

1567
01:02:58,130 --> 01:02:56,220
there

1568
01:03:00,620 --> 01:02:58,140
if you work for you know I work for an

1569
01:03:02,630 --> 01:03:00,630
agency that's been investigated for

1570
01:03:04,190 --> 01:03:02,640
certain business practices and stuff

1571
01:03:06,500 --> 01:03:04,200
like that I'm not stupid I know I'm not

1572
01:03:08,779 --> 01:03:06,510
gonna implicate them and some kind of

1573
01:03:11,240 --> 01:03:08,789
wrongdoing if I want to keep my job so I

1574
01:03:13,609 --> 01:03:11,250
and in Jeff in general I don't think

1575
01:03:15,980 --> 01:03:13,619
ever there's this idea with conspiracy

1576
01:03:17,510 --> 01:03:15,990
theories this is just vast conspiracy

1577
01:03:19,940 --> 01:03:17,520
that everybody's in on it and

1578
01:03:21,589 --> 01:03:19,950
everybody's deceiving everybody else and

1579
01:03:22,640 --> 01:03:21,599
I don't think it necessarily has to be

1580
01:03:25,160 --> 01:03:22,650
that way I don't think you have to

1581
01:03:27,230 --> 01:03:25,170
really be in on it to be kind of

1582
01:03:30,109 --> 01:03:27,240
complicit in it you're just just doing

1583
01:03:33,289 --> 01:03:30,119
your job you just kind of keep your job

1584
01:03:36,319 --> 01:03:33,299
and not rock the boat but do you think

1585
01:03:37,730 --> 01:03:36,329
like by the end of the investigation do

1586
01:03:39,410 --> 01:03:37,740
you think that everybody who was

1587
01:03:43,940 --> 01:03:39,420
investigating it knew that it was a

1588
01:03:50,750 --> 01:03:43,950
controlled demolition know do you think

1589
01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:50,760
anybody figured it out maybe maybe I'm

1590
01:03:55,730 --> 01:03:52,490
sure you've seen those video clips of

1591
01:03:58,490 --> 01:03:55,740
David Chandler challenging the freefall

1592
01:04:01,519 --> 01:03:58,500
I was kind of find it amusing that part

1593
01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:01,529
was when mr. sundar is axis about

1594
01:04:06,710 --> 01:04:04,770
freefall and he kind of trips over his

1595
01:04:08,960 --> 01:04:06,720
own words for about 30 seconds before he

1596
01:04:10,370 --> 01:04:08,970
says anything that makes any sense and

1597
01:04:12,859 --> 01:04:10,380
David Chandler says something like that

1598
01:04:14,690 --> 01:04:12,869
something like whoa that's the kind of

1599
01:04:16,539 --> 01:04:14,700
response I get from a physics student

1600
01:04:19,339 --> 01:04:16,549
when they haven't bothered open the book

1601
01:04:20,930 --> 01:04:19,349
which is kind of funny do you mean Shyam

1602
01:04:23,720 --> 01:04:20,940
sunder the guy who led the NIST

1603
01:04:27,430 --> 01:04:23,730
investigation do you think he didn't he

1604
01:04:31,130 --> 01:04:27,440
knew that it was controlled demolition

1605
01:04:35,750 --> 01:04:31,140
intuitively maybe so you think he felt

1606
01:04:38,180 --> 01:04:35,760
that it was but he didn't know it I'm

1607
01:04:40,250 --> 01:04:38,190
not sure Mick to be honest with you it's

1608
01:04:42,289 --> 01:04:40,260
it's hard to speculate about what's

1609
01:04:44,569 --> 01:04:42,299
going on and you think he would have

1610
01:04:46,730 --> 01:04:44,579
more evidence available than anybody so

1611
01:04:48,990 --> 01:04:46,740
what do architects and engineers know

1612
01:04:51,960 --> 01:04:49,000
that he doesn't know

1613
01:04:53,760 --> 01:04:51,970
right right well it's really difficult

1614
01:04:55,710 --> 01:04:53,770
to speculate about what's going on in

1615
01:04:57,870 --> 01:04:55,720
somebody else's head you know yeah you

1616
01:04:59,940 --> 01:04:57,880
can you can be suspicious I'm suspicious

1617
01:05:02,190 --> 01:04:59,950
of him but I don't have proof that you

1618
01:05:03,810 --> 01:05:02,200
lied or the proof that he fabricated

1619
01:05:08,010 --> 01:05:03,820
anything is suspicions

1620
01:05:10,950 --> 01:05:08,020
so do you think they say the FBI agents

1621
01:05:13,980 --> 01:05:10,960
who investigators 911 half of the FBI

1622
01:05:16,790 --> 01:05:13,990
the cost of billions of dollars was

1623
01:05:18,720 --> 01:05:16,800
tasked with investigating 911 and

1624
01:05:20,190 --> 01:05:18,730
tracking down the hijackers and

1625
01:05:23,370 --> 01:05:20,200
everything and the sources of money and

1626
01:05:26,460 --> 01:05:23,380
things like that do you think all those

1627
01:05:30,150 --> 01:05:26,470
agents were fooled or just a percentage

1628
01:05:31,349 --> 01:05:30,160
of them were fooled I don't know

1629
01:05:33,089 --> 01:05:31,359
anything about that part of the

1630
01:05:35,270 --> 01:05:33,099
investigation I haven't researched it I

1631
01:05:37,470 --> 01:05:35,280
don't know exactly what the FBI did or

1632
01:05:38,790 --> 01:05:37,480
well I don't really want to comment

1633
01:05:40,650 --> 01:05:38,800
speculate on that

1634
01:05:43,859 --> 01:05:40,660
well if you just assume like for a

1635
01:05:47,430 --> 01:05:43,869
second that half the FBI was working for

1636
01:05:49,260 --> 01:05:47,440
two years investigating 9/11 and would

1637
01:05:52,260 --> 01:05:49,270
you be comfortable saying that that was

1638
01:05:54,300 --> 01:05:52,270
true I don't know I don't even I'm the

1639
01:05:54,690 --> 01:05:54,310
first time I heard that is from you all

1640
01:05:57,720 --> 01:05:54,700
right

1641
01:05:59,329 --> 01:05:57,730
yeah well he's in the I guess all the

1642
01:06:02,070 --> 01:05:59,339
all the accounts something you're wrong

1643
01:06:04,980 --> 01:06:02,080
yeah I guess how would you know that

1644
01:06:07,380 --> 01:06:04,990
it's true it's a good have a good a good

1645
01:06:09,270 --> 01:06:07,390
point but obviously lots of people work

1646
01:06:13,230 --> 01:06:09,280
at the FBI all the people who work at

1647
01:06:14,400 --> 01:06:13,240
the FBI would know roughly what people

1648
01:06:15,720 --> 01:06:14,410
were working on like they would say

1649
01:06:17,570 --> 01:06:15,730
these teams were assigned to this and

1650
01:06:20,579 --> 01:06:17,580
yeah we there must have been people who

1651
01:06:24,240 --> 01:06:20,589
thought they were investigating 9/11 who

1652
01:06:27,300 --> 01:06:24,250
worked at the FBI so I guess by the

1653
01:06:30,630 --> 01:06:27,310
point I'm trying to get at is was the

1654
01:06:32,670 --> 01:06:30,640
entire FBI complicit or was there some

1655
01:06:34,410 --> 01:06:32,680
kind of strange compartmentalization

1656
01:06:36,480 --> 01:06:34,420
going on where there was this strange

1657
01:06:39,599 --> 01:06:36,490
theater where they pretended to

1658
01:06:41,400 --> 01:06:39,609
investigate don't know how many people

1659
01:06:43,620 --> 01:06:41,410
were working at the FBI but per se it's

1660
01:06:45,870 --> 01:06:43,630
like 10,000 or something and 5,000 of

1661
01:06:48,300 --> 01:06:45,880
them were working let's just look this

1662
01:06:49,260 --> 01:06:48,310
up real quick let's not speculate when

1663
01:06:56,540 --> 01:06:49,270
we can look things up

1664
01:07:02,370 --> 01:07:00,359
that's 35,000 people working at the FBI

1665
01:07:03,870 --> 01:07:02,380
and they said about about

1666
01:07:06,270 --> 01:07:03,880
half the people who work to the FBI

1667
01:07:08,670 --> 01:07:06,280
we're working on 911 it was probably

1668
01:07:11,250 --> 01:07:08,680
actually more than that because people

1669
01:07:12,150 --> 01:07:11,260
would be rather yeah reluctant to work

1670
01:07:15,770 --> 01:07:12,160
on anything else

1671
01:07:18,750 --> 01:07:15,780
so where's half at 35,000 17,000 people

1672
01:07:23,370 --> 01:07:18,760
were working on the investigation of

1673
01:07:25,530 --> 01:07:23,380
9/11 how how would that work if if it

1674
01:07:28,950 --> 01:07:25,540
was a big government conspiracy and

1675
01:07:31,020 --> 01:07:28,960
there were pre planted explosives in the

1676
01:07:34,350 --> 01:07:31,030
building and that all had to be covered

1677
01:07:38,250 --> 01:07:34,360
up if you got 17,000 people looking into

1678
01:07:41,340 --> 01:07:38,260
this isn't it kind of risky it is and

1679
01:07:44,550 --> 01:07:41,350
it's it's a valid question I would I

1680
01:07:47,610 --> 01:07:44,560
can't prove any of that to you but what

1681
01:07:49,080 --> 01:07:47,620
I can say is provide you an example the

1682
01:07:50,640 --> 01:07:49,090
Manhattan Project involves over a

1683
01:07:52,920 --> 01:07:50,650
hundred thousand people and it was kept

1684
01:07:55,200 --> 01:07:52,930
very secret for quite a while wasn't

1685
01:07:56,250 --> 01:07:55,210
kept secret from the FBI investigation

1686
01:07:58,050 --> 01:07:56,260
that there wasn't like a big

1687
01:08:00,570 --> 01:07:58,060
investigation saying why did this bomb

1688
01:08:02,610 --> 01:08:00,580
go off so let's say like you know the

1689
01:08:05,580 --> 01:08:02,620
Hiroshima happened and no one knew why

1690
01:08:07,530 --> 01:08:05,590
it happened and the FBI CS we gonna find

1691
01:08:10,410 --> 01:08:07,540
out who dropped this atomic bomb and

1692
01:08:14,190 --> 01:08:10,420
it's not looking into it that's the kind

1693
01:08:17,480 --> 01:08:14,200
of situation you're in after 9/11

1694
01:08:19,410 --> 01:08:17,490
something big has happened the FBI

1695
01:08:20,010 --> 01:08:19,420
thinks they've got to try to figure out

1696
01:08:22,410 --> 01:08:20,020
what it is

1697
01:08:26,340 --> 01:08:22,420
now the Manhattan Project with the

1698
01:08:28,770 --> 01:08:26,350
atomic bomb development the FBI's job is

1699
01:08:30,630 --> 01:08:28,780
to protect the secrecy of that it's not

1700
01:08:33,330 --> 01:08:30,640
their job to investigated it's their job

1701
01:08:36,750 --> 01:08:33,340
to protect the secrecy and its wartime

1702
01:08:39,710 --> 01:08:36,760
and everybody knows that it's this top

1703
01:08:42,210 --> 01:08:39,720
secret it's not the same situation you

1704
01:08:45,000 --> 01:08:42,220
know here we've got a disappointment

1705
01:08:48,090 --> 01:08:45,010
we've got an actual investigation of

1706
01:08:51,420 --> 01:08:48,100
something or we've got some kind of

1707
01:08:54,210 --> 01:08:51,430
strange theater where 17,000 FBI agents

1708
01:08:55,880 --> 01:08:54,220
are pretending to investigate I just

1709
01:08:58,500 --> 01:08:55,890
don't see how it could possibly work I

1710
01:09:00,330 --> 01:08:58,510
see what you're saying it's a good point

1711
01:09:02,910 --> 01:09:00,340
I would I would need to know more about

1712
01:09:04,740 --> 01:09:02,920
the FBI investigation and who did what

1713
01:09:08,590 --> 01:09:04,750
and who's exactly looking into word and

1714
01:09:10,030 --> 01:09:08,600
what they found is you know because

1715
01:09:12,400 --> 01:09:10,040
it's really complicated through the

1716
01:09:15,220 --> 01:09:12,410
company yeah I think there's a article

1717
01:09:16,530 --> 01:09:15,230
on the FBI page on that I mean I look at

1718
01:09:20,920 --> 01:09:16,540
it real quick

1719
01:09:22,690 --> 01:09:20,930
so what FBI say about it they say our

1720
01:09:24,730 --> 01:09:22,700
ensuing investigations of the attacks of

1721
01:09:27,160 --> 01:09:24,740
9/11 codenamed pent bond was our largest

1722
01:09:29,530 --> 01:09:27,170
investigation ever at the peak of the

1723
01:09:30,910 --> 01:09:29,540
case more than half our agents work to

1724
01:09:33,760 --> 01:09:30,920
identify the hijackers and their

1725
01:09:35,559 --> 01:09:33,770
sponsors and with other agencies to head

1726
01:09:37,420 --> 01:09:35,569
off any possible future attacks

1727
01:09:39,550 --> 01:09:37,430
we followed more than half a million

1728
01:09:40,980 --> 01:09:39,560
investigative leads including several

1729
01:09:43,420 --> 01:09:40,990
hundred thousand tips from the public

1730
01:09:45,430 --> 01:09:43,430
the attack and the crash sites also

1731
01:09:48,940 --> 01:09:45,440
represented the largest crime scene in

1732
01:09:52,240 --> 01:09:48,950
FBI history so yes a half of all their

1733
01:09:55,870 --> 01:09:52,250
agents were working on on that speaking

1734
01:09:57,610 --> 01:09:55,880
of crime scenes Nick it's it's a federal

1735
01:10:01,360 --> 01:09:57,620
offense to remove anything from a crime

1736
01:10:04,210 --> 01:10:01,370
scene even a matchbook and yet a lot of

1737
01:10:08,200 --> 01:10:04,220
evidence and ground zero was destroyed

1738
01:10:10,150 --> 01:10:08,210
and shipped overseas and there was there

1739
01:10:11,770 --> 01:10:10,160
was some something of an outcry from the

1740
01:10:13,960 --> 01:10:11,780
engineering community about that yeah

1741
01:10:15,550 --> 01:10:13,970
there wasn't even there was but not

1742
01:10:20,230 --> 01:10:15,560
because it was a crime scene they wanted

1743
01:10:21,730 --> 01:10:20,240
to investigate to see exactly why the

1744
01:10:23,980 --> 01:10:21,740
buildings collapsed the way that they

1745
01:10:26,290 --> 01:10:23,990
collapse I don't think there was I mean

1746
01:10:27,670 --> 01:10:26,300
any outcry from anybody other than

1747
01:10:31,510 --> 01:10:27,680
people who thought there was a

1748
01:10:33,450 --> 01:10:31,520
controlled demolition about crime scene

1749
01:10:36,640 --> 01:10:33,460
contamination because what was happening

1750
01:10:38,170 --> 01:10:36,650
everybody assumed that the buildings

1751
01:10:39,550 --> 01:10:38,180
have collapsed because of the planes

1752
01:10:43,210 --> 01:10:39,560
hitting them and there being a big fire

1753
01:10:46,540 --> 01:10:43,220
and the priority initially was try to

1754
01:10:48,430 --> 01:10:46,550
find survivors in the wreckage and to do

1755
01:10:50,290 --> 01:10:48,440
that they had to move a whole bunch of

1756
01:10:52,480 --> 01:10:50,300
steel out of the way so they could get

1757
01:10:54,190 --> 01:10:52,490
in there and but if they would they were

1758
01:10:57,970 --> 01:10:54,200
hopeful that they were find survivors

1759
01:10:59,260 --> 01:10:57,980
for a few days afterwards it quickly

1760
01:11:01,930 --> 01:10:59,270
became apparent that they weren't going

1761
01:11:04,750 --> 01:11:01,940
to they did dig a few people out the

1762
01:11:07,060 --> 01:11:04,760
people stuck in a well but they didn't

1763
01:11:08,800 --> 01:11:07,070
consider it to be a crime scene in the

1764
01:11:10,510 --> 01:11:08,810
traditional sense of like somebody was

1765
01:11:11,980 --> 01:11:10,520
murdered in their living room and

1766
01:11:15,160 --> 01:11:11,990
there's blood splattered on the wall and

1767
01:11:18,060 --> 01:11:15,170
those footprints on the ground the crime

1768
01:11:20,830 --> 01:11:18,070
scene was in the cockpits of the planes

1769
01:11:22,390 --> 01:11:20,840
the crime was that these hijackers

1770
01:11:24,250 --> 01:11:22,400
hijacked these planes of

1771
01:11:25,930 --> 01:11:24,260
and flew them into the buildings that's

1772
01:11:29,140 --> 01:11:25,940
what they considered the crime scene to

1773
01:11:32,410 --> 01:11:29,150
actually be you know FBI says the idea

1774
01:11:35,950 --> 01:11:32,420
the the site is the crime scene but

1775
01:11:37,390 --> 01:11:35,960
that's like saying that an entire town

1776
01:11:41,890 --> 01:11:37,400
is a crime scene because a murder

1777
01:11:45,189 --> 01:11:41,900
occurred in the in the town yeah pretty

1778
01:11:46,860 --> 01:11:45,199
pretty wouldn't say it's nothing now I

1779
01:11:50,140 --> 01:11:46,870
do yeah okay

1780
01:11:51,580 --> 01:11:50,150
issued read read of the accounts of

1781
01:11:53,649 --> 01:11:51,590
people who worked on the World Trade

1782
01:11:55,750 --> 01:11:53,659
Center site there was there's a good one

1783
01:11:57,550 --> 01:11:55,760
by a guy called Douglas Freedman who I

1784
01:12:00,520 --> 01:11:57,560
interviewed on the podcast a while back

1785
01:12:02,740 --> 01:12:00,530
and he talked about what the priorities

1786
01:12:06,220 --> 01:12:02,750
were when they were cleaning up the site

1787
01:12:09,729 --> 01:12:06,230
and the number one priority after they

1788
01:12:12,700 --> 01:12:09,739
got done with rescue the number one

1789
01:12:15,520 --> 01:12:12,710
priority was recovery which was recovery

1790
01:12:17,410 --> 01:12:15,530
of human remains and that's pretty much

1791
01:12:20,500 --> 01:12:17,420
when everybody who was working on the

1792
01:12:23,169 --> 01:12:20,510
site was really focusing on was trying

1793
01:12:25,740 --> 01:12:23,179
to remember all the human remains as

1794
01:12:28,000 --> 01:12:25,750
quickly as possible so they could be

1795
01:12:31,209 --> 01:12:28,010
given back to the family subvert the

1796
01:12:32,830 --> 01:12:31,219
people and they the end people who work

1797
01:12:34,660 --> 01:12:32,840
there got extremely emotional about it

1798
01:12:36,160 --> 01:12:34,670
and every time they discovered a new

1799
01:12:38,169 --> 01:12:36,170
body after a while they would start

1800
01:12:41,020 --> 01:12:38,179
having these processions where they

1801
01:12:42,520 --> 01:12:41,030
would put the remains in a wooden coffin

1802
01:12:45,430 --> 01:12:42,530
and they would carry them out and salute

1803
01:12:48,010 --> 01:12:45,440
them but yeah that's what was going on

1804
01:12:51,189 --> 01:12:48,020
they weren't trying to clean up the site

1805
01:12:53,649 --> 01:12:51,199
to hide the steal or anything like that

1806
01:12:56,310 --> 01:12:53,659
they were removing the steal so they

1807
01:13:01,060 --> 01:12:56,320
could remove the bodies the steal why

1808
01:13:03,399 --> 01:13:01,070
didn't they did preserve it they they

1809
01:13:05,680 --> 01:13:03,409
took it most of it was taken to Fresh

1810
01:13:07,720 --> 01:13:05,690
Kills I'm Phil and it's sat there for

1811
01:13:09,280 --> 01:13:07,730
quite a while now most of it flung a

1812
01:13:12,850 --> 01:13:09,290
little bit of it not know a little bit

1813
01:13:15,100 --> 01:13:12,860
was a little bit was restored it was for

1814
01:13:16,930 --> 01:13:15,110
long term but initially like they it was

1815
01:13:19,120 --> 01:13:16,940
several weeks or months that it was

1816
01:13:21,130 --> 01:13:19,130
there before it was moved away they

1817
01:13:23,919 --> 01:13:21,140
insist I guess details that we could

1818
01:13:27,250 --> 01:13:23,929
actually look up but this whole thing

1819
01:13:29,110 --> 01:13:27,260
about the crime scene thing doesn't

1820
01:13:31,660 --> 01:13:29,120
really make any sense to me it may make

1821
01:13:34,090 --> 01:13:31,670
sense to you because you think there

1822
01:13:35,290 --> 01:13:34,100
might have been a crime of a controlled

1823
01:13:37,080 --> 01:13:35,300
demolition

1824
01:13:39,370 --> 01:13:37,090
but everybody who was there on the day

1825
01:13:41,770 --> 01:13:39,380
all the people who were working there

1826
01:13:43,360 --> 01:13:41,780
thought that terrorists at hijacked

1827
01:13:45,280 --> 01:13:43,370
planes and flown them into the buildings

1828
01:13:46,150 --> 01:13:45,290
which they had and then they thought

1829
01:13:48,580 --> 01:13:46,160
that the buildings that collapsed

1830
01:13:51,400 --> 01:13:48,590
because of that he had the no one even

1831
01:13:53,110 --> 01:13:51,410
thought that the buildings are collapse

1832
01:13:56,710 --> 01:13:53,120
from explosives so no one thought there

1833
01:13:58,180 --> 01:13:56,720
was any reason to look for explosive

1834
01:14:00,250 --> 01:13:58,190
residue or whatever they what they would

1835
01:14:02,410 --> 01:14:00,260
do or examine the steel for for cutting

1836
01:14:06,910 --> 01:14:02,420
and things like that mm-hmm

1837
01:14:09,160 --> 01:14:06,920
you know you with Eric lawyer right he's

1838
01:14:12,190 --> 01:14:09,170
the founder of firefighters for 9/11

1839
01:14:14,620 --> 01:14:12,200
truth he talks about the NFPA standards

1840
01:14:18,310 --> 01:14:14,630
for the investigations of building

1841
01:14:21,940 --> 01:14:18,320
failures and the NFPA the National Fire

1842
01:14:23,230 --> 01:14:21,950
Protection Association and seems pretty

1843
01:14:25,090 --> 01:14:23,240
clear from what he's talking about that

1844
01:14:27,820 --> 01:14:25,100
the standard procedure wasn't followed

1845
01:14:29,200 --> 01:14:27,830
and even it's you know even if there's

1846
01:14:31,570 --> 01:14:29,210
no reason to think there's a controlled

1847
01:14:33,790 --> 01:14:31,580
demolition don't we typically follow our

1848
01:14:35,620 --> 01:14:33,800
procedures anyway then we do due process

1849
01:14:39,850 --> 01:14:35,630
like everybody knows that Oh Jay Simpson

1850
01:14:41,230 --> 01:14:39,860
killed those people we still went that's

1851
01:14:43,540 --> 01:14:41,240
a little bit different terrace icing is

1852
01:14:44,110 --> 01:14:43,550
there weren't any eyewitnesses to what

1853
01:14:45,700 --> 01:14:44,120
happened

1854
01:14:47,260 --> 01:14:45,710
whereas what everyone saw the planes

1855
01:14:48,870 --> 01:14:47,270
fall into fly into the buildings and

1856
01:14:50,560 --> 01:14:48,880
then the fires and then the collapses

1857
01:14:53,320 --> 01:14:50,570
yeah

1858
01:14:56,590 --> 01:14:53,330
the this the standard procedure for

1859
01:14:58,120 --> 01:14:56,600
investigating fires has a consideration

1860
01:15:02,890 --> 01:14:58,130
for investigating whether it was arson

1861
01:15:05,080 --> 01:15:02,900
or what but I think again in this case

1862
01:15:09,400 --> 01:15:05,090
for everyone's point of view the the

1863
01:15:11,320 --> 01:15:09,410
causes of the fire were obvious planes

1864
01:15:12,730 --> 01:15:11,330
flow into the building planes full of

1865
01:15:15,840 --> 01:15:12,740
fuel and there was a big fuel air

1866
01:15:19,180 --> 01:15:15,850
explosion and fires started because

1867
01:15:23,170 --> 01:15:19,190
planes live into the building so why

1868
01:15:25,270 --> 01:15:23,180
would you but that they they did

1869
01:15:28,900 --> 01:15:25,280
actually because the the guidelines

1870
01:15:31,150 --> 01:15:28,910
I give essentially leeway to people to

1871
01:15:33,340 --> 01:15:31,160
decide when to follow the guidelines say

1872
01:15:36,460 --> 01:15:33,350
if it's not necessary like if it's so

1873
01:15:38,980 --> 01:15:36,470
obvious that it's it's not actually

1874
01:15:41,110 --> 01:15:38,990
needed like if someone actually saw

1875
01:15:42,730 --> 01:15:41,120
somebody like the Christmas tree on fire

1876
01:15:45,040 --> 01:15:42,740
and so they have video of that's

1877
01:15:45,790 --> 01:15:45,050
actually burning the house down then

1878
01:15:47,260 --> 01:15:45,800
they don't need to have any

1879
01:15:49,299 --> 01:15:47,270
investigation to see if someone like

1880
01:15:51,189 --> 01:15:49,309
that lit the Christmas tree on fire

1881
01:15:52,959 --> 01:15:51,199
and same thing here we saw what happened

1882
01:15:54,870 --> 01:15:52,969
somebody flew planes into the building's

1883
01:15:59,020 --> 01:15:54,880
and that's why they caught on fire and

1884
01:16:01,299 --> 01:15:59,030
the fires burnt very intensely for an

1885
01:16:03,669 --> 01:16:01,309
hour and the buildings collapsed that's

1886
01:16:06,250 --> 01:16:03,679
what happened maybe in addition to that

1887
01:16:08,290 --> 01:16:06,260
there was some explosives but no one

1888
01:16:10,899 --> 01:16:08,300
thought that at the time I wouldn't say

1889
01:16:12,520 --> 01:16:10,909
no one thought a lot of people didn't

1890
01:16:17,859 --> 01:16:12,530
think that but you didn't think that I

1891
01:16:19,540 --> 01:16:17,869
mean I did well I know that's not

1892
01:16:22,720 --> 01:16:19,550
another further explosive I thought it

1893
01:16:24,700 --> 01:16:22,730
was really peculiar in a day and I kind

1894
01:16:28,000 --> 01:16:24,710
of just dismissed my concerns for a

1895
01:16:29,979 --> 01:16:28,010
while but I mean there are there's

1896
01:16:31,540 --> 01:16:29,989
plenty of accounts of people on that day

1897
01:16:33,370 --> 01:16:31,550
saying it looks like a controlled

1898
01:16:35,620 --> 01:16:33,380
demolition of looks like the enclosure

1899
01:16:37,569 --> 01:16:35,630
now it looks like demolition crew came

1900
01:16:39,310 --> 01:16:37,579
here and if you look at the news clips

1901
01:16:42,310 --> 01:16:39,320
20 people said that even some of the

1902
01:16:45,370 --> 01:16:42,320
experts van Romero said that originally

1903
01:16:47,339 --> 01:16:45,380
he retracted his statement but he said

1904
01:16:50,620 --> 01:16:47,349
that there's footage of Ground Zero of

1905
01:16:52,149 --> 01:16:50,630
firefighters and well the people first

1906
01:16:54,580 --> 01:16:52,159
responders saying I think there was a

1907
01:16:57,160 --> 01:16:54,590
bomb there so I wouldn't think nobody

1908
01:16:59,890 --> 01:16:57,170
thought that ya know somebody somebody

1909
01:17:01,149 --> 01:16:59,900
probably just Lee did I'm sure the what

1910
01:17:04,510 --> 01:17:01,159
I'm talking about is the people who made

1911
01:17:07,510 --> 01:17:04,520
the decision or didn't make a decision

1912
01:17:09,220 --> 01:17:07,520
to treat the scene as a crime scene like

1913
01:17:11,589 --> 01:17:09,230
who is gonna make that decision I guess

1914
01:17:13,720 --> 01:17:11,599
it would be the right owner the chief

1915
01:17:16,299 --> 01:17:13,730
fire the head of the fire department at

1916
01:17:17,979 --> 01:17:16,309
the time whoever it was that their

1917
01:17:20,140 --> 01:17:17,989
priorities right then were rescuing

1918
01:17:22,600 --> 01:17:20,150
people they probably didn't even stop to

1919
01:17:24,390 --> 01:17:22,610
think I is there the possibility of its

1920
01:17:26,589 --> 01:17:24,400
building collapse because there were

1921
01:17:28,330 --> 01:17:26,599
explosives planted on the same floors

1922
01:17:31,060 --> 01:17:28,340
that the plane hit and where the fires

1923
01:17:32,919 --> 01:17:31,070
were yeah even just saying it it seems a

1924
01:17:34,870 --> 01:17:32,929
little bit ridiculous like there was

1925
01:17:36,760 --> 01:17:34,880
there were bombs planted on the same

1926
01:17:38,709 --> 01:17:36,770
flaws that the planes hit I don't think

1927
01:17:40,689 --> 01:17:38,719
that's the allegation well that's where

1928
01:17:44,350 --> 01:17:40,699
the collapse started

1929
01:17:46,239 --> 01:17:44,360
yes yes I think the allegation if you

1930
01:17:48,669 --> 01:17:46,249
watch some not that you're gonna watch

1931
01:17:50,949 --> 01:17:48,679
it but if you like that new Pro Pearl

1932
01:17:53,049 --> 01:17:50,959
Harbor film that I've mentioned the

1933
01:17:56,049 --> 01:17:53,059
allegation is that the core was taken

1934
01:17:57,100 --> 01:17:56,059
out first which means these closest

1935
01:17:58,629 --> 01:17:57,110
didn't necessarily have to be on the

1936
01:18:00,969 --> 01:17:58,639
same floor as a plane they were probably

1937
01:18:03,219 --> 01:18:00,979
lower than that took the core out first

1938
01:18:05,979 --> 01:18:03,229
and I saw a video the other day of

1939
01:18:07,959 --> 01:18:05,989
somebody from FEMA was a gene Corley

1940
01:18:10,810 --> 01:18:07,969
maybe somebody from FEMA I think it was

1941
01:18:13,000 --> 01:18:10,820
gene Corley but maybe not showing that

1942
01:18:14,529 --> 01:18:13,010
the antenna began to fall first before

1943
01:18:17,589 --> 01:18:14,539
the rest of the building and he said

1944
01:18:20,020 --> 01:18:17,599
FEMA guy said this is an indication that

1945
01:18:20,979 --> 01:18:20,030
the core collapse first yeah I think

1946
01:18:22,479 --> 01:18:20,989
I've seen that I mean that's been

1947
01:18:25,149 --> 01:18:22,489
knocking around for a long time the idea

1948
01:18:28,959 --> 01:18:25,159
that says the core class first but yeah

1949
01:18:30,459 --> 01:18:28,969
again there's lots of people have looked

1950
01:18:32,169 --> 01:18:30,469
into the collapse of the World Trade

1951
01:18:33,790 --> 01:18:32,179
Center there's been like a number of

1952
01:18:38,020 --> 01:18:33,800
studies Dianna stir you know why it

1953
01:18:40,149 --> 01:18:38,030
collapsed and it's it's not it's not

1954
01:18:42,100 --> 01:18:40,159
hugely complicated in terms of like the

1955
01:18:43,600 --> 01:18:42,110
the basic physics what's complicated is

1956
01:18:45,339 --> 01:18:43,610
knowing exactly what order things

1957
01:18:47,830 --> 01:18:45,349
happened because we can't we don't know

1958
01:18:50,949 --> 01:18:47,840
he's other what calms failed first so

1959
01:18:53,409 --> 01:18:50,959
we're never going to know but the

1960
01:18:56,500 --> 01:18:53,419
physics behind the collapse aren't

1961
01:18:58,509 --> 01:18:56,510
hugely difficult in my mind I once once

1962
01:19:01,239 --> 01:18:58,519
it started to collapse there was no way

1963
01:19:03,100 --> 01:19:01,249
of stopping it and the combination of

1964
01:19:06,699 --> 01:19:03,110
the damage in the fire seems sufficient

1965
01:19:08,739 --> 01:19:06,709
to cause the the original collapse again

1966
01:19:10,689 --> 01:19:08,749
I'm gonna make reference for the new

1967
01:19:13,149 --> 01:19:10,699
Pearl Harbor film again there's an

1968
01:19:14,889 --> 01:19:13,159
interesting argument about that in there

1969
01:19:17,199 --> 01:19:14,899
and I've maybe you can tell me how

1970
01:19:19,239 --> 01:19:17,209
accurate their depiction of the official

1971
01:19:22,810 --> 01:19:19,249
explanation is because maybe they have

1972
01:19:24,819 --> 01:19:22,820
it wrong but what they're saying is that

1973
01:19:28,870 --> 01:19:24,829
the explanation is that the trusses

1974
01:19:30,549 --> 01:19:28,880
sagged mmm and pulled the exterior

1975
01:19:33,069 --> 01:19:30,559
columns inwards and you do see that

1976
01:19:35,620 --> 01:19:33,079
inward growing of the columns before the

1977
01:19:38,560 --> 01:19:35,630
class and the theory there that the film

1978
01:19:40,870 --> 01:19:38,570
is espousing is that the trusses if

1979
01:19:42,370 --> 01:19:40,880
they're so weak by fire that they're

1980
01:19:43,719 --> 01:19:42,380
collapsing under their own weight how do

1981
01:19:45,879 --> 01:19:43,729
they have the strength to break the

1982
01:19:47,739 --> 01:19:45,889
exterior column no the pulling the

1983
01:19:50,139 --> 01:19:47,749
column is B and huh

1984
01:19:54,189 --> 01:19:50,149
that they pull the columns I actually do

1985
01:19:59,650 --> 01:19:54,199
an experiment so my youtube channel

1986
01:20:02,500 --> 01:19:59,660
where I take a chain and I string in

1987
01:20:04,419 --> 01:20:02,510
between two two columns so it acts like

1988
01:20:06,010 --> 01:20:04,429
like a floor truss like that the trusses

1989
01:20:08,350 --> 01:20:06,020
are the metal structure underneath the

1990
01:20:10,450 --> 01:20:08,360
concrete floors it's kind of a zigzag

1991
01:20:11,650 --> 01:20:10,460
yep you can look up trusses online

1992
01:20:15,760 --> 01:20:11,660
people want to know what a trust looks

1993
01:20:17,950 --> 01:20:15,770
like now a truss is a rigid structure so

1994
01:20:20,169 --> 01:20:17,960
when it's when it's there in place it

1995
01:20:22,390 --> 01:20:20,179
sits between the columns in the middle

1996
01:20:25,120 --> 01:20:22,400
and the columns on the outside so it's

1997
01:20:28,870 --> 01:20:25,130
providing rigidity between between the

1998
01:20:32,010 --> 01:20:28,880
inside and the outside so it's it gives

1999
01:20:36,520 --> 01:20:32,020
the whole structure some some strength

2000
01:20:39,520 --> 01:20:36,530
now if you heat up a copper heat of a

2001
01:20:43,570 --> 01:20:39,530
truss so it becomes softer and starts to

2002
01:20:45,520 --> 01:20:43,580
sag instead of providing that that's

2003
01:20:48,490 --> 01:20:45,530
strength and that resistance it actually

2004
01:20:51,130 --> 01:20:48,500
starts to pull inwards by its own weight

2005
01:20:52,330 --> 01:20:51,140
now you ask how strong it is it's going

2006
01:20:56,500 --> 01:20:52,340
to be relevant if it hasn't

2007
01:20:58,930 --> 01:20:56,510
if it hasn't broken it's as strong as a

2008
01:21:00,669 --> 01:20:58,940
rope is strong you know a rope doesn't

2009
01:21:03,490 --> 01:21:00,679
provide any strength in terms of

2010
01:21:06,550 --> 01:21:03,500
resisting pushing forces but if you take

2011
01:21:09,820 --> 01:21:06,560
a say a hundred foot long rope or even

2012
01:21:14,800 --> 01:21:09,830
better a 50 foot long chain with very

2013
01:21:18,459 --> 01:21:14,810
thick links and you hook one end to one

2014
01:21:21,040 --> 01:21:18,469
wall and hold one an end and then try to

2015
01:21:24,430 --> 01:21:21,050
pull that chain straight you won't be

2016
01:21:27,310 --> 01:21:24,440
able to do it because chains sag and

2017
01:21:28,750 --> 01:21:27,320
they pull inwards because the sagging so

2018
01:21:31,180 --> 01:21:28,760
what's happened is you've kind of taken

2019
01:21:33,130 --> 01:21:31,190
this truss which is a rigid structure

2020
01:21:35,229 --> 01:21:33,140
and by heating it up you make it into a

2021
01:21:37,930 --> 01:21:35,239
slot a soft structure kind of like a

2022
01:21:40,330 --> 01:21:37,940
rope or a chain and so it starts to sag

2023
01:21:42,550 --> 01:21:40,340
and it starts to pull in from size just

2024
01:21:45,100 --> 01:21:42,560
like a loose chain would if you put it

2025
01:21:46,740 --> 01:21:45,110
between two hooks and because it starts

2026
01:21:50,800 --> 01:21:46,750
out perfectly horizontal

2027
01:21:52,810 --> 01:21:50,810
if creates a huge amount of pulling

2028
01:21:54,340 --> 01:21:52,820
force because you know how much force it

2029
01:21:55,720 --> 01:21:54,350
would take to pull a chain perfectly

2030
01:21:58,479 --> 01:21:55,730
straight like a really heavy chain

2031
01:22:01,300 --> 01:21:58,489
that's first quite long so it pulls in

2032
01:22:02,320 --> 01:22:01,310
the walls from the outside and that's

2033
01:22:03,790 --> 01:22:02,330
what you see hmm

2034
01:22:05,890 --> 01:22:03,800
that's what you see in the video you see

2035
01:22:07,080 --> 01:22:05,900
the walls being gradually pulled in and

2036
01:22:08,730 --> 01:22:07,090
then eventually they

2037
01:22:11,340 --> 01:22:08,740
kind of a sudden in what Paul as they

2038
01:22:13,560 --> 01:22:11,350
they give way and then once the outside

2039
01:22:15,450 --> 01:22:13,570
walls are no longer supporting anything

2040
01:22:17,220 --> 01:22:15,460
the load gets transferred inside the

2041
01:22:18,900 --> 01:22:17,230
building and there isn't enough

2042
01:22:21,480 --> 01:22:18,910
remaining capacity amongst the remaining

2043
01:22:25,770 --> 01:22:21,490
columns and so some of the core columns

2044
01:22:26,760 --> 01:22:25,780
fail and the building collapses I think

2045
01:22:29,190 --> 01:22:26,770
I know what you're going to say to this

2046
01:22:31,860 --> 01:22:29,200
but I'm gonna ask you anyway what do you

2047
01:22:33,870 --> 01:22:31,870
make of the pulverization of all the

2048
01:22:36,750 --> 01:22:33,880
contents of the buildings and to my mind

2049
01:22:38,730 --> 01:22:36,760
you got to a hundred and ten story

2050
01:22:41,460 --> 01:22:38,740
alternate buildings there should have

2051
01:22:46,020 --> 01:22:41,470
been thousands and thousands of filing

2052
01:22:47,880 --> 01:22:46,030
cabinets computers desk chairs and I've

2053
01:22:49,320 --> 01:22:47,890
heard a lot of different testimony of

2054
01:22:50,580 --> 01:22:49,330
people at Ground Zero that said man

2055
01:22:52,800 --> 01:22:50,590
who's just dust and metal

2056
01:22:54,870 --> 01:22:52,810
you know you don't find a desk you don't

2057
01:22:56,940 --> 01:22:54,880
find a chair you don't find a telephone

2058
01:22:58,830 --> 01:22:56,950
a computer the biggest piece of a

2059
01:23:01,920 --> 01:22:58,840
telephone I found was half the keypad

2060
01:23:03,510 --> 01:23:01,930
big ya heard this from a lot of

2061
01:23:06,360 --> 01:23:03,520
different people what do you make of

2062
01:23:08,820 --> 01:23:06,370
that look have you ever seen those those

2063
01:23:10,980 --> 01:23:08,830
videos on YouTube where they take an

2064
01:23:14,220 --> 01:23:10,990
industrial grinder and they toss things

2065
01:23:15,510 --> 01:23:14,230
into it no no check them out kind of a

2066
01:23:16,950 --> 01:23:15,520
kind of interesting but they will take

2067
01:23:18,390 --> 01:23:16,960
things like this there's grinders that

2068
01:23:21,090 --> 01:23:18,400
you can toss things into and it'll grind

2069
01:23:23,040 --> 01:23:21,100
up a car mmm the smaller grain is like

2070
01:23:25,440 --> 01:23:23,050
you're a paper shredder you probably

2071
01:23:27,420 --> 01:23:25,450
have papers for it is at the office

2072
01:23:29,070 --> 01:23:27,430
that you still go to taking some sheets

2073
01:23:30,300 --> 01:23:29,080
of paper and these teeth gonna go crunch

2074
01:23:33,330 --> 01:23:30,310
crunch crunch and they they grind

2075
01:23:35,790 --> 01:23:33,340
through it what happened with the World

2076
01:23:37,380 --> 01:23:35,800
Trade Centers collapsing was that as

2077
01:23:39,240 --> 01:23:37,390
things fell you know obviously they get

2078
01:23:40,590 --> 01:23:39,250
faster by the time most of the steel

2079
01:23:43,260 --> 01:23:40,600
reached the ground he was going between

2080
01:23:45,120 --> 01:23:43,270
50 and 100 miles an hour and there was a

2081
01:23:47,130 --> 01:23:45,130
lot of it all packed into this one place

2082
01:23:48,930 --> 01:23:47,140
and it wasn't just like big beams of

2083
01:23:51,180 --> 01:23:48,940
small bits of steel from the trusses

2084
01:23:54,960 --> 01:23:51,190
being mangled together and there was all

2085
01:23:57,000 --> 01:23:54,970
kinds of other heavy bits of steel and

2086
01:23:59,060 --> 01:23:57,010
machinery and stuff very very rapidly

2087
01:24:01,770 --> 01:23:59,070
coming down in this very small area and

2088
01:24:04,050 --> 01:24:01,780
essentially it acted like a giant

2089
01:24:05,730 --> 01:24:04,060
grinder it's at a very very rapid water

2090
01:24:07,950 --> 01:24:05,740
it was just like there was an instant

2091
01:24:09,600 --> 01:24:07,960
that pulverization of everything as an

2092
01:24:11,640 --> 01:24:09,610
engineer Richard's human you might have

2093
01:24:13,110 --> 01:24:11,650
heard of him he was the chief electrical

2094
01:24:16,290 --> 01:24:13,120
engineer for the Twin Towers

2095
01:24:19,670 --> 01:24:16,300
Angele and he he talked about these

2096
01:24:22,640 --> 01:24:19,680
enormous enormous transformers that

2097
01:24:25,790 --> 01:24:22,650
on multiple floors that weighed tens of

2098
01:24:28,490 --> 01:24:25,800
tons and they were never found that when

2099
01:24:30,230 --> 01:24:28,500
it's completely eradicated do you think

2100
01:24:32,300 --> 01:24:30,240
that do you think they could have been

2101
01:24:34,640 --> 01:24:32,310
grinded the way you're describing yeah

2102
01:24:39,410 --> 01:24:34,650
I'm a transformer is just a bunch of

2103
01:24:44,180 --> 01:24:39,420
bunch of wire wrapped around the core so

2104
01:24:46,850 --> 01:24:44,190
it's it's unless it had a solid steel

2105
01:24:49,190 --> 01:24:46,860
core of a specific shape we should

2106
01:24:50,660 --> 01:24:49,200
probably get stripped away that if

2107
01:24:53,480 --> 01:24:50,670
you've ever been to the I'm sure you

2108
01:24:56,000 --> 01:24:53,490
have you been to the Memorial Museum no

2109
01:24:57,920 --> 01:24:56,010
I won't go there I don't like I don't

2110
01:25:00,230 --> 01:24:57,930
like the 9/11 Museum and it's not

2111
01:25:02,780 --> 01:25:00,240
because of conspiracy theories no stay

2112
01:25:05,030 --> 01:25:02,790
in the center i I I'm a New Yorker and

2113
01:25:06,590 --> 01:25:05,040
they basically treat Ground Zero like

2114
01:25:08,720 --> 01:25:06,600
it's Disneyland like it's an attraction

2115
01:25:11,540 --> 01:25:08,730
and I take exception to that I wouldn't

2116
01:25:12,910 --> 01:25:11,550
say it's it's pretty respectful and

2117
01:25:15,140 --> 01:25:12,920
there's there's one section especially

2118
01:25:18,170 --> 01:25:15,150
from others it was a number of sections

2119
01:25:19,340 --> 01:25:18,180
that have increased seriousness like

2120
01:25:20,690 --> 01:25:19,350
there's this one section where they

2121
01:25:23,990 --> 01:25:20,700
weren't let you take any cameras and

2122
01:25:25,580 --> 01:25:24,000
there's another one which is whether

2123
01:25:28,130 --> 01:25:25,590
they they share the names of all the

2124
01:25:30,830 --> 01:25:28,140
people who who lost their lives there

2125
01:25:32,990 --> 01:25:30,840
and yeah that Hill I mean there's a

2126
01:25:36,050 --> 01:25:33,000
there's a gift shop where they sell Tori

2127
01:25:38,450 --> 01:25:36,060
fire trucks yeah there is yeah that's it

2128
01:25:40,490 --> 01:25:38,460
it's they didn't they didn't originally

2129
01:25:41,600 --> 01:25:40,500
want to have a gift shop when they did

2130
01:25:44,300 --> 01:25:41,610
the museum because they thought it would

2131
01:25:45,680 --> 01:25:44,310
be disrespectful but people asked for a

2132
01:25:48,320 --> 01:25:45,690
gift shop because they wanted to have

2133
01:25:50,270 --> 01:25:48,330
something to remember it by and you

2134
01:25:52,790 --> 01:25:50,280
could argue this a bit tacky but if

2135
01:25:55,220 --> 01:25:52,800
people wanted a memorial though they

2136
01:25:56,450 --> 01:25:55,230
could take away and you know I bought

2137
01:25:59,540 --> 01:25:56,460
things in the gift shop I bought some

2138
01:26:01,820 --> 01:25:59,550
books we have a really tiny tiny 9/11

2139
01:26:05,570 --> 01:26:01,830
museum here on Staten Island actually is

2140
01:26:07,910 --> 01:26:05,580
it does have a gift shop now this is one

2141
01:26:10,160 --> 01:26:07,920
it's like basically one room okay in a

2142
01:26:12,410 --> 01:26:10,170
place called it's in a place called Snug

2143
01:26:15,170 --> 01:26:12,420
Harbor which is a cultural center that

2144
01:26:16,610 --> 01:26:15,180
used to be a lodging for sailors and

2145
01:26:19,220 --> 01:26:16,620
they have all kinds of different

2146
01:26:20,870 --> 01:26:19,230
buildings there 9/11 memorial we have a

2147
01:26:22,910 --> 01:26:20,880
memorial near the Staten Island Ferry as

2148
01:26:25,640 --> 01:26:22,920
well it's very interesting actually it

2149
01:26:27,890 --> 01:26:25,650
shows all the faces of the people of

2150
01:26:30,440 --> 01:26:27,900
ever killed from Staten Island and then

2151
01:26:33,439 --> 01:26:30,450
they're done like in stone animal world

2152
01:26:35,510 --> 01:26:33,449
and pretty intense yeah that's why they

2153
01:26:36,620 --> 01:26:35,520
the the Memorial Museum is pretty

2154
01:26:38,840 --> 01:26:36,630
intense especially at the actual

2155
01:26:41,060 --> 01:26:38,850
memorial part of it which is where the

2156
01:26:42,740 --> 01:26:41,070
men will realize the people it's very

2157
01:26:46,130 --> 01:26:42,750
emotional people very emotional I mean

2158
01:26:50,209 --> 01:26:46,140
like first time I went there I I had a

2159
01:26:52,490 --> 01:26:50,219
few tears but and you see they have they

2160
01:26:54,169 --> 01:26:52,500
have boxes of tissues around it because

2161
01:26:58,070 --> 01:26:54,179
everyone who goes in there starts

2162
01:26:59,840 --> 01:26:58,080
growing up so it's yeah yeah it's it's

2163
01:27:01,520 --> 01:26:59,850
not it's not making light of the

2164
01:27:03,200 --> 01:27:01,530
situation I don't know I could I

2165
01:27:05,959 --> 01:27:03,210
understand you not liking the gift shop

2166
01:27:08,090 --> 01:27:05,969
but it's yeah I wouldn't yes hey go

2167
01:27:10,340 --> 01:27:08,100
there because it's up to you but it's

2168
01:27:11,870 --> 01:27:10,350
but my point really was that they they

2169
01:27:13,729 --> 01:27:11,880
have some stuff from the World Trade

2170
01:27:15,919 --> 01:27:13,739
Center that survived the collapse like

2171
01:27:18,620 --> 01:27:15,929
they have one of the engines for the

2172
01:27:20,870 --> 01:27:18,630
elevators things I know we should you

2173
01:27:22,459 --> 01:27:20,880
reminded me of you said the transformer

2174
01:27:24,050 --> 01:27:22,469
and I think an engine elevator would be

2175
01:27:26,540 --> 01:27:24,060
a simple type of thing that I did

2176
01:27:29,150 --> 01:27:26,550
survive and the empty of lots of things

2177
01:27:30,950 --> 01:27:29,160
like effects of people and yes some

2178
01:27:33,229 --> 01:27:30,960
office contents but obviously not very

2179
01:27:35,560 --> 01:27:33,239
much the you get back to the original

2180
01:27:38,720 --> 01:27:35,570
point I think there wasn't a

2181
01:27:40,880 --> 01:27:38,730
disintegration of things by explosives

2182
01:27:42,950 --> 01:27:40,890
that doesn't even make any sense but why

2183
01:27:45,229 --> 01:27:42,960
would the office contents be

2184
01:27:46,640 --> 01:27:45,239
disintegrated by explosives because the

2185
01:27:49,070 --> 01:27:46,650
office contents aren't holding of the

2186
01:27:51,950 --> 01:27:49,080
walls or with the point of blowing up

2187
01:27:54,350 --> 01:27:51,960
the desks with the points of blowing on

2188
01:27:55,640 --> 01:27:54,360
the telephones and if something is far

2189
01:27:57,770 --> 01:27:55,650
enough away from any explosion it's

2190
01:27:59,600 --> 01:27:57,780
gonna maintain its shape these things

2191
01:28:01,220 --> 01:27:59,610
were all just crushed by the falling

2192
01:28:03,470 --> 01:28:01,230
building they were they weren't blown up

2193
01:28:05,510 --> 01:28:03,480
by by explosives doesn't mean the words

2194
01:28:08,479 --> 01:28:05,520
explosives it's not evidence for

2195
01:28:09,740 --> 01:28:08,489
explosives mm-hmm it occurs to me that

2196
01:28:13,130 --> 01:28:09,750
we've been talking for about two hours

2197
01:28:15,979 --> 01:28:13,140
now we haven't even the hopefully report

2198
01:28:18,320 --> 01:28:15,989
yeah what do you think about the whole

2199
01:28:20,270 --> 01:28:18,330
see report I mean you just like briefly

2200
01:28:21,860 --> 01:28:20,280
like one of the things you can't you

2201
01:28:24,410 --> 01:28:21,870
mentioned when you emailed me was that

2202
01:28:25,820 --> 01:28:24,420
you you thought I had some good

2203
01:28:27,800 --> 01:28:25,830
questions about the whole secret force

2204
01:28:30,050 --> 01:28:27,810
and you were hoping that you'd get some

2205
01:28:32,840 --> 01:28:30,060
answers yeah yeah I'm particularly

2206
01:28:34,130 --> 01:28:32,850
disturbed by the point you made about

2207
01:28:36,320 --> 01:28:34,140
the penthouse

2208
01:28:38,750 --> 01:28:36,330
I would just kind of drops and it

2209
01:28:40,729 --> 01:28:38,760
doesn't doesn't show us any of the

2210
01:28:42,770 --> 01:28:40,739
girder sequences or what's happening

2211
01:28:44,540 --> 01:28:42,780
with that it's kind of its peers yes

2212
01:28:46,359 --> 01:28:44,550
because it's not actually a simulation

2213
01:28:51,040 --> 01:28:46,369
that

2214
01:28:52,720 --> 01:28:51,050
by people within architects and

2215
01:28:54,609 --> 01:28:52,730
engineers for 9/11 truth like somebody

2216
01:28:56,950 --> 01:28:54,619
asked somebody and they go back to me

2217
01:28:58,589 --> 01:28:56,960
and I said yeah it's just what are the

2218
01:29:01,629 --> 01:28:58,599
describe it as a simple gravity

2219
01:29:03,669 --> 01:29:01,639
rotational visualization model to look

2220
01:29:05,379 --> 01:29:03,679
at the result it wasn't the actual

2221
01:29:08,560 --> 01:29:05,389
simulation it isn't they didn't actually

2222
01:29:10,209 --> 01:29:08,570
do a simulation of the penthouse

2223
01:29:12,280 --> 01:29:10,219
collapsing they just did these

2224
01:29:15,070 --> 01:29:12,290
simulations where they remove columns

2225
01:29:17,800 --> 01:29:15,080
and found out what the stress would be

2226
01:29:20,410 --> 01:29:17,810
on other columns do you think the Holte

2227
01:29:22,330 --> 01:29:20,420
report is simply mistaken and incorrect

2228
01:29:28,359 --> 01:29:22,340
or do you think it's a fraud I think it

2229
01:29:29,080 --> 01:29:28,369
is a half good-faith effort into looking

2230
01:29:32,290 --> 01:29:29,090
into it

2231
01:29:35,080 --> 01:29:32,300
I feel like hosi was predisposed to

2232
01:29:36,550 --> 01:29:35,090
think that it was controlled demolition

2233
01:29:38,500 --> 01:29:36,560
he seemed very suspicious from the start

2234
01:29:39,910 --> 01:29:38,510
and it was right here back when he

2235
01:29:41,470 --> 01:29:39,920
started it like you know wherever it

2236
01:29:43,899 --> 01:29:41,480
four years ago or something he was

2237
01:29:46,419 --> 01:29:43,909
talking about things that seemed

2238
01:29:48,459 --> 01:29:46,429
suspicious like the FBI having an office

2239
01:29:50,530 --> 01:29:48,469
there and and then yeah silly things

2240
01:29:52,270 --> 01:29:50,540
like you know they were accounting

2241
01:29:55,359 --> 01:29:52,280
offices so there wouldn't be enough

2242
01:29:57,760 --> 01:29:55,369
paper to burn yeah stuff like that that

2243
01:29:59,439 --> 01:29:57,770
if he's already thinking along those

2244
01:30:01,870 --> 01:29:59,449
lines it seems like he already had his

2245
01:30:06,100 --> 01:30:01,880
notes mind made up but he has suspicions

2246
01:30:07,930 --> 01:30:06,110
and the report itself and the study I

2247
01:30:10,780 --> 01:30:07,940
think were mostly done by one of the

2248
01:30:12,700 --> 01:30:10,790
graduate students if you look at the the

2249
01:30:14,740 --> 01:30:12,710
task breakdown so who did what there's

2250
01:30:17,229 --> 01:30:14,750
there's two graduate students I think

2251
01:30:19,359 --> 01:30:17,239
they were both from China one of them

2252
01:30:20,709 --> 01:30:19,369
now works in a local government as a

2253
01:30:21,669 --> 01:30:20,719
civil engineer and the other one has

2254
01:30:23,080 --> 01:30:21,679
gone back to China

2255
01:30:26,229 --> 01:30:23,090
okay well which one is which but one of

2256
01:30:29,290 --> 01:30:26,239
them did the simulations and I think

2257
01:30:30,609 --> 01:30:29,300
possibly did the some of the slides as

2258
01:30:33,399 --> 01:30:30,619
well on the visualization and some

2259
01:30:36,939 --> 01:30:33,409
things like that such as this one

2260
01:30:38,740 --> 01:30:36,949
graduate student who had no experience

2261
01:30:40,000 --> 01:30:38,750
whatsoever doing this type of thing

2262
01:30:42,790 --> 01:30:40,010
before and had to figure all this stuff

2263
01:30:44,620 --> 01:30:42,800
out doing this thing at the direction of

2264
01:30:47,050 --> 01:30:44,630
Professor Halsey of course but you can

2265
01:30:49,149 --> 01:30:47,060
tell from the results that it's it's

2266
01:30:51,010 --> 01:30:49,159
nowhere near as comprehensive a

2267
01:30:52,660 --> 01:30:51,020
simulation as the NIST simulation now

2268
01:30:54,010 --> 01:30:52,670
you can say all you like about the NIST

2269
01:30:56,560 --> 01:30:54,020
simulation but at least they actually

2270
01:30:59,700 --> 01:30:56,570
simulated good as moving sure like you

2271
01:31:01,220 --> 01:30:59,710
know their problems were there the

2272
01:31:03,959 --> 01:31:01,230
it's a lot better than what ho stated

2273
01:31:05,940 --> 01:31:03,969
pulses graduate she didn't did my mom

2274
01:31:08,070 --> 01:31:05,950
I'm looking at I'm looking at two models

2275
01:31:10,200 --> 01:31:08,080
now and I'm looking at two models and

2276
01:31:13,830 --> 01:31:10,210
neither one of them to me

2277
01:31:15,390 --> 01:31:13,840
is mirroring that claps yeah else's

2278
01:31:18,390 --> 01:31:15,400
house is only mirrors the collapse

2279
01:31:20,910 --> 01:31:18,400
because he set it up to mirror the

2280
01:31:24,680 --> 01:31:20,920
collapse he said like what would happen

2281
01:31:27,810 --> 01:31:24,690
if if we did something that would

2282
01:31:30,540 --> 01:31:27,820
essentially give the results that we see

2283
01:31:33,270 --> 01:31:30,550
like and what he did was ridiculous

2284
01:31:35,790 --> 01:31:33,280
he cut columns underneath the penthouse

2285
01:31:38,250 --> 01:31:35,800
and had it settled into the building and

2286
01:31:40,860 --> 01:31:38,260
then he cut all the columns over the

2287
01:31:42,060 --> 01:31:40,870
multiple floors simultaneously which is

2288
01:31:45,330 --> 01:31:42,070
something there was no evidence for

2289
01:31:47,310 --> 01:31:45,340
whatsoever and yeah like I say you can

2290
01:31:49,320 --> 01:31:47,320
you can criticize this for you can

2291
01:31:51,540 --> 01:31:49,330
criticize in this simulation but in this

2292
01:31:53,400 --> 01:31:51,550
simulations actually is a lot better

2293
01:31:56,280 --> 01:31:53,410
than the healthiest thing and just

2294
01:31:58,650 --> 01:31:56,290
because horses crappy simulation looks

2295
01:32:01,110 --> 01:31:58,660
better it doesn't mean it actually is

2296
01:32:02,430 --> 01:32:01,120
better right anyway this is probably

2297
01:32:04,709 --> 01:32:02,440
something we'd probably need a lot more

2298
01:32:06,540 --> 01:32:04,719
time to get into and we don't really we

2299
01:32:09,750 --> 01:32:06,550
have that say now but yeah I would like

2300
01:32:11,430 --> 01:32:09,760
to talk about it if you if you sure I

2301
01:32:14,370 --> 01:32:11,440
want to respect your I want inspect your

2302
01:32:16,229 --> 01:32:14,380
time and but uh thank you thank you for

2303
01:32:18,780 --> 01:32:16,239
talking with me today me you know thank

2304
01:32:21,720 --> 01:32:18,790
you thank you for for for for contacting

2305
01:32:23,610 --> 01:32:21,730
me and and secondly for talking to me

2306
01:32:25,800 --> 01:32:23,620
and I appreciate your position I know

2307
01:32:28,470 --> 01:32:25,810
you have a lot of respect for the the

2308
01:32:30,750 --> 01:32:28,480
victims of 911 and you have concerns and

2309
01:32:33,150 --> 01:32:30,760
I would hope that those concerns can be

2310
01:32:35,130 --> 01:32:33,160
resolved one way the other you know I be

2311
01:32:36,270 --> 01:32:35,140
fine with another investigation but I

2312
01:32:38,220 --> 01:32:36,280
know it's not going to happen just

2313
01:32:41,310 --> 01:32:38,230
because there isn't there isn't the

2314
01:32:44,040 --> 01:32:41,320
justification for it so I guess we'll

2315
01:32:45,450 --> 01:32:44,050
see where the 9/11 truth movement truth

2316
01:32:48,080 --> 01:32:45,460
movement goes over the next few years

2317
01:32:50,550 --> 01:32:48,090
yeah I'm gonna pay a lot of attention to

2318
01:32:52,979 --> 01:32:50,560
the whole see in his response to his

2319
01:32:55,620 --> 01:32:52,989
critics and see what happens everybody

2320
01:32:57,479 --> 01:32:55,630
else you gotta be you gotta admit to be

2321
01:32:57,990 --> 01:32:57,489
fair we do have to hear his response oh

2322
01:33:01,020 --> 01:32:58,000
yeah

2323
01:33:03,900 --> 01:33:01,030
know what to hereas response that's uh

2324
01:33:05,729 --> 01:33:03,910
yeah will be very very interested to see

2325
01:33:07,709 --> 01:33:05,739
what he has to say if asset you can

2326
01:33:09,459 --> 01:33:07,719
understand if it seems a little peculiar

2327
01:33:11,830 --> 01:33:09,469
to me that

2328
01:33:13,649 --> 01:33:11,840
a forensic structural engineer didn't

2329
01:33:16,720 --> 01:33:13,659
understand in this model but you do

2330
01:33:20,160 --> 01:33:16,730
seems kind of crazy but I think there

2331
01:33:22,990 --> 01:33:20,170
was aspects of it he didn't understand

2332
01:33:24,550 --> 01:33:23,000
like he got a bit confused about the

2333
01:33:25,990 --> 01:33:24,560
thing with the mone modelling half the

2334
01:33:28,060 --> 01:33:26,000
building and things like that

2335
01:33:30,430 --> 01:33:28,070
so it will be very interesting to see

2336
01:33:32,439 --> 01:33:30,440
how he does actually respond to the

2337
01:33:34,810 --> 01:33:32,449
criticism he's got from on this report

2338
01:33:37,240 --> 01:33:34,820
yeah let's see and maybe we can talk

2339
01:33:39,669 --> 01:33:37,250
again after we get here something from

2340
01:33:40,600 --> 01:33:39,679
hopefully indeed yeah all right well I'm

2341
01:33:43,689 --> 01:33:40,610
definitely gonna go now

2342
01:33:46,150 --> 01:33:43,699
so thank you very much all right Nick